My kids can do/be anything they want AFTER getting a college education

I agree that not everyone is suited to higher education. But to assert as some people do that college is unnecessary and it is better to go to trade school is extraordinarily ignorant. No one who has benefitted from a true liberal arts education would ever say such a thing. They know that the point of college is not “what you do with it,” but what it does with you.

I agree also that the cost of higher education (even accounting for list prices to be significantly reduced by “aid” discounts) has become preposterous. The bankers and the schools seem to have entirely succumbed to the attraction of getting students to mortgage their very lives so that bankers and administrators prosper. I don’t know the solution. School loans took me a long way. But it seems out of hand now.

Do you count trade school as formal education? I don’t think everybody is suited for an academic undergraduate, graduate or post grad, work and schooling. So to some people it might be worthless. In the sense that it doesn’t do that individual any good or they take out massive loans that will take them into the 50s to pay off.

Context is everything, OP. I think most people with this attitude approach if from a ROI perspective, especially vis a vis student loan debt.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:etc are worthless. I think we should teach kids to aspire to get as much formal education as possible.

It is not “worthless” but it may not be worth the cost of tuition. Parents should help their children do the math. Your child wants to be an elementary school teacher with a starting salary of [$60k]. Probably shouldn’t take on more debt than one times annual salary, so no more than about [$60k]. That eliminates a lot of high priced schools.

This is an interesting post. I do think for undergrad education the student cannot really take much in loans. That may limit where they can go but there is no real alternative.

I agree with that PPs have been saying that kids should not be forced to college. But in the same way -- not all kids are ready for non-college. Not all kids are going to make it at all with a vocational education. While you should not force anyone to do anything -- the default should probably be college as a smart buyer (low loans) unless the kid can articulate and demonstrate what they intend to to. Tough when the kid is 14 but that is where it is.

Anonymous wrote:etc are worthless. I think we should teach kids to aspire to get as much formal education as possible.

It is not “worthless” but it may not be worth the cost of tuition. Parents should help their children do the math. Your child wants to be an elementary school teacher with a starting salary of [$60k]. Probably shouldn’t take on more debt than one times annual salary, so no more than about [$60k]. That eliminates a lot of high priced schools.

Anonymous wrote:I don't know one person who is anti education.

You don’t talk to enough people outside of your circle

Agree BUT the cost of college has changed the discussion, IMO. It truly isn’t a wise choice for everyone, and most people now have to consider alternative ways to higher education or even skipping it altogether. I think it’s a shame because an educated society is moral imperative. But it is what it is.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:etc are worthless. I think we should teach kids to aspire to get as much formal education as possible.

This is how we have ended up with entry level jobs that require a Masters degree. In a lot of situations, it’s just gatekeeping. An example from my profession - many states now require candidates to have 150 credit hours to become a CPA. However, once you meet the minimum required credits in accounting and business courses, the rest of the credits could be in literally anything. It has nothing to do with becoming a better accountant, it’s just about keeping out the riff raff.

It protects salaries in the profession.

I don't know one person who is anti education.

Anonymous wrote:etc are worthless. I think we should teach kids to aspire to get as much formal education as possible.

This is how we have ended up with entry level jobs that require a Masters degree. In a lot of situations, it’s just gatekeeping. An example from my profession - many states now require candidates to have 150 credit hours to become a CPA. However, once you meet the minimum required credits in accounting and business courses, the rest of the credits could be in literally anything. It has nothing to do with becoming a better accountant, it’s just about keeping out the riff raff.

Anonymous wrote:etc are worthless. I think we should teach kids to aspire to get as much formal education as possible.

I dislike the fact that pursuing as much formal education as possible saddles kids with tens - if not hundreds - of thousands of dollars worth of debt.

I think there does need to be a reinvestment in manual jobs, but we have to make it so that these jobs compensate enough to build a life and support a family. There need to be multiple viable paths to success in this country if we hope to be successful as a society.

Anonymous wrote:etc are worthless. I think we should teach kids to aspire to get as much formal education as possible.

Not everyone is meant for a lot of formal education. What is the point of forcing a kid who wants to work with his hands and be an electrician to go get a master's degree? I don't believe in formal education for formal education's sake. I do believe kids should be taught and encouraged to be life-long learner but that doesn't have to be (and shouldn't be) at formal educational institutions.

etc are worthless. I think we should teach kids to aspire to get as much formal education as possible.