OP: it’s not that I’m advocating vocational training. I get the value of learning how to read, write, think critically, problem solve. And I see the fringe benefit of art stuff as a fun and healthy activity. But where the arts oriented people lose me is when they choose one school over another based on the arts programming as opposed to variables that may have a more significant long term impact. Like choosing a less reputable school because there are good pottery classes. It just seems that these things are nice to have but for $320k maybe they don’t matter that much and you should be focused on other factors?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“The point of college athletics is to use it to get into college, not to be a member of a team that had a 10-4 record rather than 8-6.”

This is not true, lots of college athletes are there on sports scholarships. You may only be familiar with obscure D3 private colleges, but they’re a minuscule portion of schools with sports.

Same thing. You are using sports to get accepted into college and/or get college paid for. Does it really matter if the team wins?

Oh my - you really aren't an athlete, are you? Yes, it really matters if the team wins or loses. For some kids it matters in t-ball, it matters in little league, it matters in high school, and it matters in college, regardless of whether they play club, D3, or D1. Heck, whether I win or not STILL matters to me, and I'm 50 and play a rec sport as an adult. Why bother if you don't care? If you just want fitness go to Zumba or lift some weights. Sports are the only thing that get my kid to sit through class every day, so I sure as heck am going to help him find a college that will provide what he needs to thrive in college. I imagine the same thing is true for a kid who finds their motivation in sculpture, or chess, or hip hop dance, or spoken word poetry. It matters. It all matters.

It’s a combination of things. For some, it’s being able to connect a high school activity that they enjoyed and devoted a lot of time to that they want to continue in college and hope a side benefit is meeting people/finding community. From a pre-professional standpoint, they could be pursuing a career as an artist but they could also be leveraging it with adjacent careers like video game designer, animation, film, journalism, film producer/production, advertising, UI/UX designer etc. My kid is not a sports kid so a lot of their leadership, teamwork, project management and public speaking experience has been from Theatre with experience as an actor and also production team.

I think you're a better contributor to any environment (work, community, school, etc) when your education included more than just job training in one area. And if you're going to go to a place that will expose you to more than just job training, shouldn't it be a place that does all the things well instead of just one thing well? I want to support a college that values more than just vocational training.

My daughter is a highly academic kid but she would be a hermit and depressed shell of her former self if she didn't have an involved community of dancers and performing artists around her.

My DC who graduated with a double math/physics major couldn't have survived college without being able to participate in orchestra. When Covid shut everything down he was devastated, but fortunately they were able to connect on Zoom and still play together.

DD did a club sport all four years of college (graduating in May) and is so glad she did.

Anonymous wrote:I’m not some kind of uncultured Neanderthal, I’m really not, but I find it a bit strange when I see parents focusing on the strength of this or that school’s art/theatre/music/dance programs. I get it, your kid is good at art, wants to stay with it, but come on. Unless you are loaded and the kid will never have to worry about supporting himself or herself, who cares about the quality of the art programming? It’s a nice hobby and a nice side benefit of going to college, but to prioritize it seems impractical to me. It’s hard for me to relate to. It’s like choosing a college based on how good the sports team is. Who cares? The point of college athletics is to use it to get into college, not to be a member of a team that had a 10-4 record rather than 8-6.

What am I missing?

The years of 18-21 are important in terms of developing as a full person--it's nearly the last window of brain development, it's the first period of somewhat independent adult life, and it's the time when you have the luxury to engage with broad aspects of life. If a kid is into the arts, staying with that alongside of whatever else they are studying will be interesting and good for their mental health now but also lay the groundwork for a cultural and creative life. Likewise for sports--you're laying more groundwork for healthy activity. Also, both help build a sense of belonging to the school which is one of the strongest predictors for academic success.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“The point of college athletics is to use it to get into college, not to be a member of a team that had a 10-4 record rather than 8-6.”

This is not true, lots of college athletes are there on sports scholarships. You may only be familiar with obscure D3 private colleges, but they’re a minuscule portion of schools with sports.

Same thing. You are using sports to get accepted into college and/or get college paid for. Does it really matter if the team wins?

Yes. Otherwise being away from home for 4 years, especially in a cold climate, is isolating & intense. Increases student suicide risk.

You are missing that some kids really thrive when participating in these programs, so they care that they will be in a place that supports it. Every kid has something they want that will make the college experience a happier, better four years for them. For some it is a football tradition, for others it is Greek life, for some it is easy access to hiking and climbing or surfing, for some it is weather, and for some it is a vibrant fine arts program.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“The point of college athletics is to use it to get into college, not to be a member of a team that had a 10-4 record rather than 8-6.”

This is not true, lots of college athletes are there on sports scholarships. You may only be familiar with obscure D3 private colleges, but they’re a minuscule portion of schools with sports.

Same thing. You are using sports to get accepted into college and/or get college paid for. Does it really matter if the team wins?

+1

When the world was shut down during a pandemic, we needed the scientists and doctors to help cure us. But we also needed the artists and writers. How much Netflix did you stream? How many books did you read? How did you find and share joy and meaning in your life?

It's not enough to simply be alive and earn money. You need purpose, connections, community. These come from the the study and expression of language and art.

Anonymous wrote:“The point of college athletics is to use it to get into college, not to be a member of a team that had a 10-4 record rather than 8-6.”

This is not true, lots of college athletes are there on sports scholarships. You may only be familiar with obscure D3 private colleges, but they’re a minuscule portion of schools with sports.

Same thing. You are using sports to get accepted into college and/or get college paid for. Does it really matter if the team wins?

“The point of college athletics is to use it to get into college, not to be a member of a team that had a 10-4 record rather than 8-6.”

This is not true, lots of college athletes are there on sports scholarships. You may only be familiar with obscure D3 private colleges, but they’re a minuscule portion of schools with sports.

I’m not some kind of uncultured Neanderthal, I’m really not, but I find it a bit strange when I see parents focusing on the strength of this or that school’s art/theatre/music/dance programs. I get it, your kid is good at art, wants to stay with it, but come on. Unless you are loaded and the kid will never have to worry about supporting himself or herself, who cares about the quality of the art programming? It’s a nice hobby and a nice side benefit of going to college, but to prioritize it seems impractical to me. It’s hard for me to relate to. It’s like choosing a college based on how good the sports team is. Who cares? The point of college athletics is to use it to get into college, not to be a member of a team that had a 10-4 record rather than 8-6.

What am I missing?