Anonymous
08/01/2022 11:10
Subject: Re:S/O Defiant children as adults
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:My defiant kid finally grew up and is attending a great law school. He has a wonderful sense of humor, lots of friends and a super sweet girlfriend that he treats well. This is the same kid that ruined pretty much every vacation and family outing because he didn't want to be there, fought/argued with us about everything under the sun from a young age. We never gave up on him and he appreciates us a lot more now. He knows what a PITA he was....we can joke about it now but yeesh.
Whew! You’re describing my 8 yo and this gives me hope. Sometimes it’s just - so much.
Yes, this was my oldest as well. We called him “Bartleby” because he preferred not to do just about everything and was strung as tightly as a guitar string. Fast forward- he is a passionate and compassionate young adult who is thoughtful, adventurous, and yes, still unconventional. But whereas we tiptoed around every situation when he was younger now he is truly a pleasure to have around. And the main difference is his sense of self-awareness. Once that started to develop as a teen, it was a huge game changer.
Anonymous
08/01/2022 08:32
Subject: Re:S/O Defiant children as adults
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I would be much more worried about the rule follower. I raised my six kids to be defiant. To have the guts to stand their ground no matter who doesn't like it. Raise them with a good, solid base and teach them to always stand up for what they believe in. The defiant one will have more luck as an adult than the compliant one. Compliance creates slaves of society. I spent my whole life defying those who tried to control me. If you give someone an inch, they'll take your freedom. I am not afraid to take risks. I have always been the defiant one. I've also had a lot more fun than those who are fearful. I was born fearless. Everything is an adrenaline rush except for mediocrity.
Disagree. I would definitely be worried more about my defiant kid. Why would you raise your kids to be defiant?
"Defiant kids have patterns of anger, irritability, arguing, toward adults and authority figures. They also have Angry and irritable mood swings.
Often and easily loses temper
Is frequently touchy and easily annoyed by others
Is often angry and resentful
Argumentative and defiant behavior:
Often argues with adults or people in authority
Often actively defies or refuses to comply with adults' requests or rules
Often deliberately annoys or upsets people
Often blames others for his or her mistakes or misbehavior"
The poster you are responding to is not using “defiant” in the more clinical way you and everyone else on here means. The poster with the six kids is just smugly patting herself for raising kids to always question authority. I suspect this goes well beyond raising kids to be critical thinkers, which most of us aspire to do.
Anonymous
08/01/2022 08:29
Subject: Re:S/O Defiant children as adults
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I would be much more worried about the rule follower. I raised my six kids to be defiant. To have the guts to stand their ground no matter who doesn't like it. Raise them with a good, solid base and teach them to always stand up for what they believe in. The defiant one will have more luck as an adult than the compliant one. Compliance creates slaves of society. I spent my whole life defying those who tried to control me. If you give someone an inch, they'll take your freedom. I am not afraid to take risks. I have always been the defiant one. I've also had a lot more fun than those who are fearful. I was born fearless. Everything is an adrenaline rush except for mediocrity.
You sound dreadful. How do you even live in society?
I think she has it right.
Anonymous
08/01/2022 08:29
Subject: Re:S/O Defiant children as adults
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I would be much more worried about the rule follower. I raised my six kids to be defiant. To have the guts to stand their ground no matter who doesn't like it. Raise them with a good, solid base and teach them to always stand up for what they believe in. The defiant one will have more luck as an adult than the compliant one. Compliance creates slaves of society. I spent my whole life defying those who tried to control me. If you give someone an inch, they'll take your freedom. I am not afraid to take risks. I have always been the defiant one. I've also had a lot more fun than those who are fearful. I was born fearless. Everything is an adrenaline rush except for mediocrity.
Disagree. I would definitely be worried more about my defiant kid. Why would you raise your kids to be defiant?
"Defiant kids have patterns of anger, irritability, arguing, toward adults and authority figures. They also have Angry and irritable mood swings.
Often and easily loses temper
Is frequently touchy and easily annoyed by others
Is often angry and resentful
Argumentative and defiant behavior:
Often argues with adults or people in authority
Often actively defies or refuses to comply with adults' requests or rules
Often deliberately annoys or upsets people
Often blames others for his or her mistakes or misbehavior"
You should question authority
Kids taught to comply with adults often are victims of abuse.
Anonymous
08/01/2022 08:26
Subject: Re:S/O Defiant children as adults
Anonymous wrote:I would be much more worried about the rule follower. I raised my six kids to be defiant. To have the guts to stand their ground no matter who doesn't like it. Raise them with a good, solid base and teach them to always stand up for what they believe in. The defiant one will have more luck as an adult than the compliant one. Compliance creates slaves of society. I spent my whole life defying those who tried to control me. If you give someone an inch, they'll take your freedom. I am not afraid to take risks. I have always been the defiant one. I've also had a lot more fun than those who are fearful. I was born fearless. Everything is an adrenaline rush except for mediocrity.
You sound dreadful. How do you even live in society?
Anonymous
08/01/2022 08:21
Subject: Re:S/O Defiant children as adults
Anonymous wrote:I would be much more worried about the rule follower. I raised my six kids to be defiant. To have the guts to stand their ground no matter who doesn't like it. Raise them with a good, solid base and teach them to always stand up for what they believe in. The defiant one will have more luck as an adult than the compliant one. Compliance creates slaves of society. I spent my whole life defying those who tried to control me. If you give someone an inch, they'll take your freedom. I am not afraid to take risks. I have always been the defiant one. I've also had a lot more fun than those who are fearful. I was born fearless. Everything is an adrenaline rush except for mediocrity.
Disagree. I would definitely be worried more about my defiant kid. Why would you raise your kids to be defiant?
"Defiant kids have patterns of anger, irritability, arguing, toward adults and authority figures. They also have Angry and irritable mood swings.
Often and easily loses temper
Is frequently touchy and easily annoyed by others
Is often angry and resentful
Argumentative and defiant behavior:
Often argues with adults or people in authority
Often actively defies or refuses to comply with adults' requests or rules
Often deliberately annoys or upsets people
Often blames others for his or her mistakes or misbehavior"
Anonymous
07/31/2022 19:04
Subject: Re:S/O Defiant children as adults
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:My defiant kid finally grew up and is attending a great law school. He has a wonderful sense of humor, lots of friends and a super sweet girlfriend that he treats well. This is the same kid that ruined pretty much every vacation and family outing because he didn't want to be there, fought/argued with us about everything under the sun from a young age. We never gave up on him and he appreciates us a lot more now. He knows what a PITA he was....we can joke about it now but yeesh.
Thank you for this. My son makes me think twice about every outing. We stopped going to restaurants even before Covid because it was just not worth it. He will not listen to teachers and I get constant complaints about his behavior and that he doesn’t care about consequences. He can be very sweet and loving though.
There is a line between defiance and antisocial behavior. I completely get that defiance itself is challenging to live with but does not equal not successful in life. I was probably pretty defiant and my DDs are as well.
That said, pay attention to whether the child can maintain friendships/relationships, even if teachers and parents are constantly aggravated. The "doesn't care about consequences" is what concerns me. Yes, my ADHD with anxiety child does not care about consequence that are not important to her, but that does not mean she does not care about consequences at all. My DD cares very much about her relationships with her friends and has put in a lot of work to develop friendship skills that did not come naturally to her (remaining calm, learning to put disappointments into perspective). I have an in-law that is estranged from the family who likely has antisocial personality disorder. He does not care about how his conduct impacts anyone but himself. That is aggravating and very painful to watch and a reason to be concerned. My understanding is that he was unable to maintain friendships his entire life despite being highly intelligent with substantial charm he could (can) turn on when it benefitted him. He is now in his 40s and I tend to think that he could have benefitted from the mental health care that is available today. They know a lot more and can have successful interventions.
Wow, my DD sounds SO similar to yours. I’m so proud of her but it’s hard to see her having to work so hard sometimes.
Anonymous
07/28/2022 19:59
Subject: Re:S/O Defiant children as adults
Anonymous wrote:My defiant kid finally grew up and is attending a great law school. He has a wonderful sense of humor, lots of friends and a super sweet girlfriend that he treats well. This is the same kid that ruined pretty much every vacation and family outing because he didn't want to be there, fought/argued with us about everything under the sun from a young age. We never gave up on him and he appreciates us a lot more now. He knows what a PITA he was....we can joke about it now but yeesh.
Whew! You’re describing my 8 yo and this gives me hope. Sometimes it’s just - so much.
Anonymous
07/28/2022 19:29
Subject: Re:S/O Defiant children as adults
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:My defiant kid finally grew up and is attending a great law school. He has a wonderful sense of humor, lots of friends and a super sweet girlfriend that he treats well. This is the same kid that ruined pretty much every vacation and family outing because he didn't want to be there, fought/argued with us about everything under the sun from a young age. We never gave up on him and he appreciates us a lot more now. He knows what a PITA he was....we can joke about it now but yeesh.
Thank you for this. My son makes me think twice about every outing. We stopped going to restaurants even before Covid because it was just not worth it. He will not listen to teachers and I get constant complaints about his behavior and that he doesn’t care about consequences. He can be very sweet and loving though.
There is a line between defiance and antisocial behavior. I completely get that defiance itself is challenging to live with but does not equal not successful in life. I was probably pretty defiant and my DDs are as well.
That said, pay attention to whether the child can maintain friendships/relationships, even if teachers and parents are constantly aggravated. The "doesn't care about consequences" is what concerns me. Yes, my ADHD with anxiety child does not care about consequence that are not important to her, but that does not mean she does not care about consequences at all. My DD cares very much about her relationships with her friends and has put in a lot of work to develop friendship skills that did not come naturally to her (remaining calm, learning to put disappointments into perspective). I have an in-law that is estranged from the family who likely has antisocial personality disorder. He does not care about how his conduct impacts anyone but himself. That is aggravating and very painful to watch and a reason to be concerned. My understanding is that he was unable to maintain friendships his entire life despite being highly intelligent with substantial charm he could (can) turn on when it benefitted him. He is now in his 40s and I tend to think that he could have benefitted from the mental health care that is available today. They know a lot more and can have successful interventions.
Anonymous
07/28/2022 14:21
Subject: Re:S/O Defiant children as adults
Anonymous wrote:My defiant kid finally grew up and is attending a great law school. He has a wonderful sense of humor, lots of friends and a super sweet girlfriend that he treats well. This is the same kid that ruined pretty much every vacation and family outing because he didn't want to be there, fought/argued with us about everything under the sun from a young age. We never gave up on him and he appreciates us a lot more now. He knows what a PITA he was....we can joke about it now but yeesh.
Thank you for this. My son makes me think twice about every outing. We stopped going to restaurants even before Covid because it was just not worth it. He will not listen to teachers and I get constant complaints about his behavior and that he doesn’t care about consequences. He can be very sweet and loving though.
Anonymous
07/28/2022 13:32
Subject: Re:S/O Defiant children as adults
My defiant kid finally grew up and is attending a great law school. He has a wonderful sense of humor, lots of friends and a super sweet girlfriend that he treats well. This is the same kid that ruined pretty much every vacation and family outing because he didn't want to be there, fought/argued with us about everything under the sun from a young age. We never gave up on him and he appreciates us a lot more now. He knows what a PITA he was....we can joke about it now but yeesh.
Anonymous
07/28/2022 11:48
Subject: Re:S/O Defiant children as adults
I would be much more worried about the rule follower. I raised my six kids to be defiant. To have the guts to stand their ground no matter who doesn't like it. Raise them with a good, solid base and teach them to always stand up for what they believe in. The defiant one will have more luck as an adult than the compliant one. Compliance creates slaves of society. I spent my whole life defying those who tried to control me. If you give someone an inch, they'll take your freedom. I am not afraid to take risks. I have always been the defiant one. I've also had a lot more fun than those who are fearful. I was born fearless. Everything is an adrenaline rush except for mediocrity.
Anonymous
07/28/2022 10:29
Subject: Re:S/O Defiant children as adults
Following this thread!
Anonymous
07/28/2022 08:41
Subject: S/O Defiant children as adults
Anonymous wrote:I have 2 young boys: one a rule follower and one very defiant. Reading the thread about dud children now makes me really worried about my defiant child. Please tell me not all defiant children grow up to be troubled! If you had one of those, please tell me how they are doing as adults and if you have any advice on how to raise such a child.
I know my father was a defiant child, and he grew up to be a successful business owner (he always told me he could never work for anyone else because of his personality
). I was probably “defiant” too (girl though so presented differently than defiance in boys) and am doing well. I have one myself now and am try to spend more time talking with her about what she’s feeling — I think reacting to big emotions drives some of her defiance — and I also really try not to engage with her in power struggles. It’s tough, good luck! But I can tell you not all defiant kids turn out to be “duds.”
Anonymous
07/28/2022 08:37
Subject: S/O Defiant children as adults
I have 2 young boys: one a rule follower and one very defiant. Reading the thread about dud children now makes me really worried about my defiant child. Please tell me not all defiant children grow up to be troubled! If you had one of those, please tell me how they are doing as adults and if you have any advice on how to raise such a child.