PD?

Anonymous wrote:It is not going to raise the bar for anyone. Kids who are struggling are not going to struggle less because the bar has been raised. It means that Teachers are going to have to focus even more on kids who are struggling to understand the current standard in order to try and getting them to a point to understand an even higher standard. So the kids on grade level, who would benefit from the bar being raised, are going to get less attention because the Teacher is going to be working more with the kids who are struggling. The kids who are advanced are going to be doing ST Math and Dreambox while being completely ignored.

I'm sure, because my kids have had them, that some teachers are amazing and capable of raising the bar for everyone. The thing is, those teachers already do that. Teachers, correct me if I'm wrong, but a little bit of PD (which is a lot of what E3 is) is probably not going to entirely remake your teaching, right?

It is not going to raise the bar for anyone. Kids who are struggling are not going to struggle less because the bar has been raised. It means that Teachers are going to have to focus even more on kids who are struggling to understand the current standard in order to try and getting them to a point to understand an even higher standard. So the kids on grade level, who would benefit from the bar being raised, are going to get less attention because the Teacher is going to be working more with the kids who are struggling. The kids who are advanced are going to be doing ST Math and Dreambox while being completely ignored.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Posting this here since it is popping up a bit in the AAP thread but it would impact all types of students…

Some here may that last year VDOE proposed in its VMPI (VA math pathways initiative) to do away with any type of math grouping of kids before 11th grade so that the only potential differentiation for math that would be delivered would be in-class (as in what happens in K-2 now, not what happens in 3-12 now). VDOE then stepped away from that idea after backlash.

Apparently FCPS is piloting this idea now though at the ES level and intends to expand it over the next few years. This is part of their published improvement plan. My youngest is in 5th so I don’t have a direct dog in this fight but thought others with younger kids may want to be aware and on the lookout for when the proposal gets drafted for expanding this program. Link and details below:

https://www.fcps.edu/node/44416

“Partner with the Advanced Academic Office to launch the Engaging, Enhanced, and Extended Mathematics (E3) Network, a group of 10 schools from across the division that will implement E3. The purpose of E3 is to broaden the access for all third and fourth graders to a more rigorous curriculum in elementary mathematics. E3 raises the rigor for all students through an enhanced program of studies that layers more opportunities for depth and complexity through flexible delivery of Advanced Academic extensions.
…
Write and obtain feedback on a five-year strategic plan to implement…the expansion of E3 in elementary schools.

E3 is just a curriculum designed to raise the bar in gen Ed. This says nothing about not being allowed to have advanced math groups.

From the above coupled with what PPs have posted in other threads on it, E3 seems to mean that all the kids are in the same math class together and there is no advanced math class (as in grouped at a class level to move quicker). Call me super skeptical that eliminating the whole class grouping of kids quicker at math will still result in math being taught well for those that need it. You can raise the bar in GE without eliminating whole class faster math instruction - but this program does not seem to have taken that path from what I have seen posted and from interpreting the FCPS language above.

You are reading the document completely wrong then. It’s from the School Improvement plan which has a goal to raise SOL scores overall. One way they will do this is by using the E3 curriculum in all classes. It doesn’t say anything about we won’t have different groupings for math. You are really reaching.

It doesn't say that. They don't want to come out and say that. But I talked to the FCPS math lead about E3 and she did indeed say that there would be an effort to do more cluster grouping in a single class. She didn't rule out advanced classes still existing, though.

On another E3 thread a poster with a kid in an E3 school who belonged in advanced math said her child was in a cluster grouped math class and was not getting advanced content. Posters have also indicated that principals have not been able to answer whether 5th graders in the top cluster groups in E3 classes will take the 6th grade math SOL (like advanced math kids do now).

Yes, the goal is to raise the bar for general education, but it's unclear that it won't practically lower the bar for level III math/level IV.

Reaching? Or lying?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Posting this here since it is popping up a bit in the AAP thread but it would impact all types of students…

Some here may that last year VDOE proposed in its VMPI (VA math pathways initiative) to do away with any type of math grouping of kids before 11th grade so that the only potential differentiation for math that would be delivered would be in-class (as in what happens in K-2 now, not what happens in 3-12 now). VDOE then stepped away from that idea after backlash.

Apparently FCPS is piloting this idea now though at the ES level and intends to expand it over the next few years. This is part of their published improvement plan. My youngest is in 5th so I don’t have a direct dog in this fight but thought others with younger kids may want to be aware and on the lookout for when the proposal gets drafted for expanding this program. Link and details below:

https://www.fcps.edu/node/44416

“Partner with the Advanced Academic Office to launch the Engaging, Enhanced, and Extended Mathematics (E3) Network, a group of 10 schools from across the division that will implement E3. The purpose of E3 is to broaden the access for all third and fourth graders to a more rigorous curriculum in elementary mathematics. E3 raises the rigor for all students through an enhanced program of studies that layers more opportunities for depth and complexity through flexible delivery of Advanced Academic extensions.
…
Write and obtain feedback on a five-year strategic plan to implement…the expansion of E3 in elementary schools.

E3 is just a curriculum designed to raise the bar in gen Ed. This says nothing about not being allowed to have advanced math groups.

From the above coupled with what PPs have posted in other threads on it, E3 seems to mean that all the kids are in the same math class together and there is no advanced math class (as in grouped at a class level to move quicker). Call me super skeptical that eliminating the whole class grouping of kids quicker at math will still result in math being taught well for those that need it. You can raise the bar in GE without eliminating whole class faster math instruction - but this program does not seem to have taken that path from what I have seen posted and from interpreting the FCPS language above.

You are reading the document completely wrong then. It’s from the School Improvement plan which has a goal to raise SOL scores overall. One way they will do this is by using the E3 curriculum in all classes. It doesn’t say anything about we won’t have different groupings for math. You are really reaching.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Posting this here since it is popping up a bit in the AAP thread but it would impact all types of students…

Some here may that last year VDOE proposed in its VMPI (VA math pathways initiative) to do away with any type of math grouping of kids before 11th grade so that the only potential differentiation for math that would be delivered would be in-class (as in what happens in K-2 now, not what happens in 3-12 now). VDOE then stepped away from that idea after backlash.

Apparently FCPS is piloting this idea now though at the ES level and intends to expand it over the next few years. This is part of their published improvement plan. My youngest is in 5th so I don’t have a direct dog in this fight but thought others with younger kids may want to be aware and on the lookout for when the proposal gets drafted for expanding this program. Link and details below:

https://www.fcps.edu/node/44416

“Partner with the Advanced Academic Office to launch the Engaging, Enhanced, and Extended Mathematics (E3) Network, a group of 10 schools from across the division that will implement E3. The purpose of E3 is to broaden the access for all third and fourth graders to a more rigorous curriculum in elementary mathematics. E3 raises the rigor for all students through an enhanced program of studies that layers more opportunities for depth and complexity through flexible delivery of Advanced Academic extensions.
…
Write and obtain feedback on a five-year strategic plan to implement…the expansion of E3 in elementary schools.

E3 is just a curriculum designed to raise the bar in gen Ed. This says nothing about not being allowed to have advanced math groups.

From the above coupled with what PPs have posted in other threads on it, E3 seems to mean that all the kids are in the same math class together and there is no advanced math class (as in grouped at a class level to move quicker). Call me super skeptical that eliminating the whole class grouping of kids quicker at math will still result in math being taught well for those that need it. You can raise the bar in GE without eliminating whole class faster math instruction - but this program does not seem to have taken that path from what I have seen posted and from interpreting the FCPS language above.

Under E3, there might still be periodic “pull out sessions” for advanced / accelerated learners for an hour or two per week. But it would depend on the school.

All this is going to do is push more parents who are engaged in their kids education to apply for AAP and put pressure on that program, one which a lot of people are already unhappy with.

My kid is in Advanced Math and finds it slow. He is not a genius, he is not Einstein reincarnate. He is a smart kid who likes math and Advanced Math, in 4th grade, is slow. He took and passed the multiplication test the first day he could. He has classmates who have not passed the test. And that is fine, kids are at different places in math with different abilities. Tossing him into a class with the kids who are not confident with multiplication means that he is going to be beyond bored. This means he will not be engaged or have any chance at being challenged. This is bad for him and the other kids like him.

We don't need a plan that tosses all kids into the same class. It is not going to help the kids who are struggling with math because the material is going to move too fast for those kids and they are going to be frustrated. It is not going to help the kids who are ahead because the material is going to move slowly. We need kids to be meet where they are and that is not done by tossing everyone in the same pot.

We need Advanced Math, so that the kids who are ahead can move at a pace that works for them. This also decreases the rest of the kids in the math class so that the Teachers can meet the needs of the kids on pace and the kids who are struggling.

If anything, we need a similar path for LA.

The idea that all kids benefit from being in the same groupings is crazy. I was the kid who was behind and struggling. I had an IEP and was pulled for individual services. I needed a different speed then the kids who were ahead. I caught up and earned a PhD. But I only caught up because my individual needs were met, thank god for my Mom in the 80's and all the parents who fight for their kids needs with the schools. I would have been screwed in an E3 program. I knew I was the kid who was struggling with math in ES. The last thing I needed was to be the kid that everyone looked at as being the class idiot (although they did already) and who was holding the entire class back.

Kids recognize who is ahead and who is behind. Crushing kids spirts and desire to learn by making it even more obvious that they are the ones holding the class back is not going to help.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Posting this here since it is popping up a bit in the AAP thread but it would impact all types of students…

Some here may that last year VDOE proposed in its VMPI (VA math pathways initiative) to do away with any type of math grouping of kids before 11th grade so that the only potential differentiation for math that would be delivered would be in-class (as in what happens in K-2 now, not what happens in 3-12 now). VDOE then stepped away from that idea after backlash.

Apparently FCPS is piloting this idea now though at the ES level and intends to expand it over the next few years. This is part of their published improvement plan. My youngest is in 5th so I don’t have a direct dog in this fight but thought others with younger kids may want to be aware and on the lookout for when the proposal gets drafted for expanding this program. Link and details below:

https://www.fcps.edu/node/44416

“Partner with the Advanced Academic Office to launch the Engaging, Enhanced, and Extended Mathematics (E3) Network, a group of 10 schools from across the division that will implement E3. The purpose of E3 is to broaden the access for all third and fourth graders to a more rigorous curriculum in elementary mathematics. E3 raises the rigor for all students through an enhanced program of studies that layers more opportunities for depth and complexity through flexible delivery of Advanced Academic extensions.
…
Write and obtain feedback on a five-year strategic plan to implement…the expansion of E3 in elementary schools.

E3 is just a curriculum designed to raise the bar in gen Ed. This says nothing about not being allowed to have advanced math groups.

From the above coupled with what PPs have posted in other threads on it, E3 seems to mean that all the kids are in the same math class together and there is no advanced math class (as in grouped at a class level to move quicker). Call me super skeptical that eliminating the whole class grouping of kids quicker at math will still result in math being taught well for those that need it. You can raise the bar in GE without eliminating whole class faster math instruction - but this program does not seem to have taken that path from what I have seen posted and from interpreting the FCPS language above.

Under E3, there might still be periodic “pull out sessions” for advanced / accelerated learners for an hour or two per week. But it would depend on the school.

Anonymous wrote:All of the bad ideas encompassed in VMPI are still in play at the Virginia Board of Education.

It appears the BOE plans to implement the ideas (without attaching the VMPI name) through the required 7-year review of the Virginia math SOL.

You have a say, however.

Please respond at this link:

https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSdNJYWjS_7VbO4682TGHfajGnbgZM1Xzhczv9RQKyuBcIg2eA/viewform

And let the DOE you oppose E3 and the ideas underlying the VMPI, including the elimination of higher math prior to 11th grade, and also oppose “blending” math concepts.

This is FCPS program, not VDOE.

^
Oops - above was from me, OP

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Posting this here since it is popping up a bit in the AAP thread but it would impact all types of students…

Some here may that last year VDOE proposed in its VMPI (VA math pathways initiative) to do away with any type of math grouping of kids before 11th grade so that the only potential differentiation for math that would be delivered would be in-class (as in what happens in K-2 now, not what happens in 3-12 now). VDOE then stepped away from that idea after backlash.

Apparently FCPS is piloting this idea now though at the ES level and intends to expand it over the next few years. This is part of their published improvement plan. My youngest is in 5th so I don’t have a direct dog in this fight but thought others with younger kids may want to be aware and on the lookout for when the proposal gets drafted for expanding this program. Link and details below:

https://www.fcps.edu/node/44416

“Partner with the Advanced Academic Office to launch the Engaging, Enhanced, and Extended Mathematics (E3) Network, a group of 10 schools from across the division that will implement E3. The purpose of E3 is to broaden the access for all third and fourth graders to a more rigorous curriculum in elementary mathematics. E3 raises the rigor for all students through an enhanced program of studies that layers more opportunities for depth and complexity through flexible delivery of Advanced Academic extensions.
…
Write and obtain feedback on a five-year strategic plan to implement…the expansion of E3 in elementary schools.

E3 is just a curriculum designed to raise the bar in gen Ed. This says nothing about not being allowed to have advanced math groups.

From the above coupled with what PPs have posted in other threads on it, E3 seems to mean that all the kids are in the same math class together and there is no advanced math class (as in grouped at a class level to move quicker). Call me super skeptical that eliminating the whole class grouping of kids quicker at math will still result in math being taught well for those that need it. You can raise the bar in GE without eliminating whole class faster math instruction - but this program does not seem to have taken that path from what I have seen posted and from interpreting the FCPS language above.

Anonymous wrote:Posting this here since it is popping up a bit in the AAP thread but it would impact all types of students…

Some here may that last year VDOE proposed in its VMPI (VA math pathways initiative) to do away with any type of math grouping of kids before 11th grade so that the only potential differentiation for math that would be delivered would be in-class (as in what happens in K-2 now, not what happens in 3-12 now). VDOE then stepped away from that idea after backlash.

Apparently FCPS is piloting this idea now though at the ES level and intends to expand it over the next few years. This is part of their published improvement plan. My youngest is in 5th so I don’t have a direct dog in this fight but thought others with younger kids may want to be aware and on the lookout for when the proposal gets drafted for expanding this program. Link and details below:

https://www.fcps.edu/node/44416

“Partner with the Advanced Academic Office to launch the Engaging, Enhanced, and Extended Mathematics (E3) Network, a group of 10 schools from across the division that will implement E3. The purpose of E3 is to broaden the access for all third and fourth graders to a more rigorous curriculum in elementary mathematics. E3 raises the rigor for all students through an enhanced program of studies that layers more opportunities for depth and complexity through flexible delivery of Advanced Academic extensions.
…
Write and obtain feedback on a five-year strategic plan to implement…the expansion of E3 in elementary schools.

E3 is just a curriculum designed to raise the bar in gen Ed. This says nothing about not being allowed to have advanced math groups.

All of the bad ideas encompassed in VMPI are still in play at the Virginia Board of Education.

It appears the BOE plans to implement the ideas (without attaching the VMPI name) through the required 7-year review of the Virginia math SOL.

You have a say, however.

Please respond at this link:

https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSdNJYWjS_7VbO4682TGHfajGnbgZM1Xzhczv9RQKyuBcIg2eA/viewform

And let the DOE you oppose E3 and the ideas underlying the VMPI, including the elimination of higher math prior to 11th grade, and also oppose “blending” math concepts.

I asked a while back for anyone sho had kids in the pilot schools to post, and only got one response. Anyone have an E3 kid?

Posting this here since it is popping up a bit in the AAP thread but it would impact all types of students…

Some here may that last year VDOE proposed in its VMPI (VA math pathways initiative) to do away with any type of math grouping of kids before 11th grade so that the only potential differentiation for math that would be delivered would be in-class (as in what happens in K-2 now, not what happens in 3-12 now). VDOE then stepped away from that idea after backlash.

Apparently FCPS is piloting this idea now though at the ES level and intends to expand it over the next few years. This is part of their published improvement plan. My youngest is in 5th so I don’t have a direct dog in this fight but thought others with younger kids may want to be aware and on the lookout for when the proposal gets drafted for expanding this program. Link and details below:

https://www.fcps.edu/node/44416

“Partner with the Advanced Academic Office to launch the Engaging, Enhanced, and Extended Mathematics (E3) Network, a group of 10 schools from across the division that will implement E3. The purpose of E3 is to broaden the access for all third and fourth graders to a more rigorous curriculum in elementary mathematics. E3 raises the rigor for all students through an enhanced program of studies that layers more opportunities for depth and complexity through flexible delivery of Advanced Academic extensions.
…
Write and obtain feedback on a five-year strategic plan to implement…the expansion of E3 in elementary schools.