Anonymous wrote:Honestly, why do we care? It's not like the Ukraine is a major economic force. They don't have oil or a large manufacturing base. I'm not sure why it would be in the US's interest to get involved.

I could probably make a good argument for NATO and/or UN involvment, but I'm not sure why the US would want to get involved on its own. Feel free to convince me otherwise.

Why should there be any world order at all? What happened when the world turned a blind eye to the Japanese Empire expanding in the Pacific? What happened when the world turned a blind eye to Germany invading Poland? The whole reason world order and laws exist is to prevent yet another world war that will kill 200+ million people. Unfortunately, many countries bout there cannot get out of their expansionist mindset and learn nothing from history.

Anonymous wrote:No one has offered any ideas for what US can do to prevent invasion. Is this something the US just can’t stop?

Good article on this topic:
https://www.wsj.com/articles/how-to-halt-putin-ukraine-push-american-troops-invasion-biden-sanctions-kyiv-kremlin-russia-11642449547

-"Formal defense ties uniting Sweden, Finland and the U.S. with a commitment to defending the Baltic states, or the restoration of close defense relations between the U.S. and Turkey (which has sold Ukraine drones and has much to fear from a resurgent Russia), would impress Mr. Putin more" than just sanctions

-"To defend peace abroad, President Biden needs to make some peace at home...The administration can and should develop a Russia policy with bipartisan support and put that unity prominently on display."

-"Finally, he needs to open an effective back channel to explore a way forward. Mr. Putin isn’t wrong that Washington and Moscow need a relationship that acknowledges Russia’s new power. Quiet conversations between senior people on both sides are likely to be more effective than official exchanges."

Anonymous wrote:Honestly, why do we care? It's not like the Ukraine is a major economic force. They don't have oil or a large manufacturing base. I'm not sure why it would be in the US's interest to get involved.

I could probably make a good argument for NATO and/or UN involvment, but I'm not sure why the US would want to get involved on its own. Feel free to convince me otherwise.

I mean, Sudetenland wasn't a "major economic force" or have "oil or a large manufacturing base" in 1938.

Thugs don't stop. They get emboldened by acquiescence.

Honestly, why do we care? It's not like the Ukraine is a major economic force. They don't have oil or a large manufacturing base. I'm not sure why it would be in the US's interest to get involved.

I could probably make a good argument for NATO and/or UN involvment, but I'm not sure why the US would want to get involved on its own. Feel free to convince me otherwise.

No one has offered any ideas for what US can do to prevent invasion. Is this something the US just can’t stop?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If Russia wants to decimate their economy, let them. Ukraine is vastly better armed and battle hardened compared to 2014. It will be a quagmire for Putin, and the sanctions alone will obliterate their economy. They won't be able to finance it for very long. Occupation is a lot harder than invasions. There will be years and years of insurgencies that will be difficult to eliminate. This may end up encouraging a country like Finland to join NATO.

This.

And if the Russians are forced out of SWIFT, it will kill their economy and isolate the oligarchs money. that won't stand.

There is a theory that the Ukraine build-up is a deflection of the Russian annexation of Belarus. That may make more sense.

Why do you think they developed Bitcoin and Ethereum? And now they've got US banks chopping at the bit to transact in it, plus a bunch of Americans have wealth tied up in it. There's a big contingent of wealthy Americans aligned with Russia on this (and opposed to the USD).

Lol. Bitcoin and Ethereum are increasingly moving more and more in lock step with the stock market. All the US would have to do is raise interest rates to give the stock market a good haircut while simultaneously taking out bitty. Kill two birds with one stone - inflation + any idiots betting on bitty.

Russia doesn't have good strategy. It can easily find itself overextended, between Kazakhstan and central asian republics, Mali and other outposts, saber rattling threats to put troops in Cuba and Venezuela and everything else they are trying to do and threatening to do. Annexation of Belarus would also be a clear announcement of intent that would mean likely annexation of other CSTO alliance members, which might not go over well in those countries despite being allies.

With regard to internal politics, Russians were favorable toward the annexation of Crimea but have been considerably less favorable toward annexation of Donbas. The Russian people are unprepared for such a war. Only 40% of Russians think a full on war with Ukraine will happen. Most think it is unlikely and 15% think it is unthinkable. Putin has been unable to sell an argument of Ukraine as a threat to Russia and so has pivoted to selling lies that NATO is the aggressor, some Russians see right through it.

Beyond the cost, economic logistics and risk of overextending itself, risk of sanctions and banking shutdowns, putting eggs in the bitcoin basket is a mistake at this point - bitcoin is breaking down in several countries. But even more dangerously, bitcoin is entirely dependent on the internet and extremely vulnerable to cyber attacks.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If Russia wants to decimate their economy, let them. Ukraine is vastly better armed and battle hardened compared to 2014. It will be a quagmire for Putin, and the sanctions alone will obliterate their economy. They won't be able to finance it for very long. Occupation is a lot harder than invasions. There will be years and years of insurgencies that will be difficult to eliminate. This may end up encouraging a country like Finland to join NATO.

This.

And if the Russians are forced out of SWIFT, it will kill their economy and isolate the oligarchs money. that won't stand.

There is a theory that the Ukraine build-up is a deflection of the Russian annexation of Belarus. That may make more sense.

Why do you think they developed Bitcoin and Ethereum? And now they've got US banks chopping at the bit to transact in it, plus a bunch of Americans have wealth tied up in it. There's a big contingent of wealthy Americans aligned with Russia on this (and opposed to the USD).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If Russia wants to decimate their economy, let them. Ukraine is vastly better armed and battle hardened compared to 2014. It will be a quagmire for Putin, and the sanctions alone will obliterate their economy. They won't be able to finance it for very long. Occupation is a lot harder than invasions. There will be years and years of insurgencies that will be difficult to eliminate. This may end up encouraging a country like Finland to join NATO.

This.

And if the Russians are forced out of SWIFT, it will kill their economy and isolate the oligarchs money. that won't stand.

There is a theory that the Ukraine build-up is a deflection of the Russian annexation of Belarus. That may make more sense.

Can you explain this further to a novice?

Anonymous wrote:Apparently throwing out elections, the Constitution, and installing Republicans into power is the only good option.

What a bunch of snakes

What does this have to do with anything posted?

Anonymous wrote:If Russia wants to decimate their economy, let them. Ukraine is vastly better armed and battle hardened compared to 2014. It will be a quagmire for Putin, and the sanctions alone will obliterate their economy. They won't be able to finance it for very long. Occupation is a lot harder than invasions. There will be years and years of insurgencies that will be difficult to eliminate. This may end up encouraging a country like Finland to join NATO.

This.

And if the Russians are forced out of SWIFT, it will kill their economy and isolate the oligarchs money. that won't stand.

There is a theory that the Ukraine build-up is a deflection of the Russian annexation of Belarus. That may make more sense.

If Russia wants to decimate their economy, let them. Ukraine is vastly better armed and battle hardened compared to 2014. It will be a quagmire for Putin, and the sanctions alone will obliterate their economy. They won't be able to finance it for very long. Occupation is a lot harder than invasions. There will be years and years of insurgencies that will be difficult to eliminate. This may end up encouraging a country like Finland to join NATO.

Missiles and ships in Romania. Retailatory cyber attacks from Estonia . Troops in Poland.

Apparently throwing out elections, the Constitution, and installing Republicans into power is the only good option.

What a bunch of snakes

Russia now has about 100,000 troops sitting on Ukraine’s border, and is sending strong signals it will invade as soon as the weather reaches the right moment. Russia is filling Ukraine media with all sorts of misinformation and fake news in advance of an attack. Biden is working with many other countries to discourage Russian aggression and warn of economic sanctions these countries will impose. Biden does not have many choices here.

The Trumpublicans - led by FoxNews - are of course supporting their Russian masters in all this, and saying the US should just let Russia invade other countries without consequence. More traditional Republicans are saying the US should send military support to Ukraine. No matter what Biden does, they’re all sure to try to blame him if Russia invades.

Are there any good options?