Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here's an example of what's being discussed. These kids are 8 years old.

https://youtu.be/s3PcdKdbkVU

The difference is parents of kids playing at Barcelona don't complain to the coaches when their kid plays CB and not striker.

Is "parents complaining" really a new thing, or unique to soccer in the USA? I mean, I'm sure parents everywhere in every sport complain about all manner of things.

I'm still mainly just curious about which is the better way to develop young players: (1) identify their naturally strongest positions/talents and play to those strengths; or (2) move them all around the field to become "well-rounded" players.

One data point is what the best youth clubs in the world do with their players.

Do you really think a parent in Spain is going to walk up to a La Masia coach and tell him where to play their son?

Good luck with that.

Barcelona pays for those players education room and board and all expenses.
Parents don’t pay anything. Nothing.

Barcelona does rotate players. The games you are seeing o YouTube are like Real Madrid academy v Barcelona academy and you are seeing the finals typically. So you are seeing one lineup. They do rotate in practice scrimmages and tournaments.

I’m not sure the Barcelona data point for selected gifted and talented kids in an immersion program is relevant to travel soccer to be honest with you.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here's an example of what's being discussed. These kids are 8 years old.

https://youtu.be/s3PcdKdbkVU

The difference is parents of kids playing at Barcelona don't complain to the coaches when their kid plays CB and not striker.

Is "parents complaining" really a new thing, or unique to soccer in the USA? I mean, I'm sure parents everywhere in every sport complain about all manner of things.

I'm still mainly just curious about which is the better way to develop young players: (1) identify their naturally strongest positions/talents and play to those strengths; or (2) move them all around the field to become "well-rounded" players.

One data point is what the best youth clubs in the world do with their players.

Do you really think a parent in Spain is going to walk up to a La Masia coach and tell him where to play their son?

Good luck with that.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here's an example of what's being discussed. These kids are 8 years old.

https://youtu.be/s3PcdKdbkVU

The difference is parents of kids playing at Barcelona don't complain to the coaches when their kid plays CB and not striker.

Is "parents complaining" really a new thing, or unique to soccer in the USA? I mean, I'm sure parents everywhere in every sport complain about all manner of things.

I'm still mainly just curious about which is the better way to develop young players: (1) identify their naturally strongest positions/talents and play to those strengths; or (2) move them all around the field to become "well-rounded" players.

One data point is what the best youth clubs in the world do with their players.

Anonymous wrote:Here's an example of what's being discussed. These kids are 8 years old.

https://youtu.be/s3PcdKdbkVU

The difference is parents of kids playing at Barcelona don't complain to the coaches when their kid plays CB and not striker.

Here's an example of what's being discussed. These kids are 8 years old.

https://youtu.be/s3PcdKdbkVU

yeah, these U10 european tournaments are basically showcases... believe it or not. Agents start looking at kids at that age to put in their pipeline for the next few years... and these big clubs have big reputations to uphold... so no they are not putting a talented striker at center back to develop him in these tournaments.

During practice or a closed door scrimmage, sure do whatever but not in a tournament that's getting broadcast on youtube for the world to see.

In American youth soccer subs are unlimited. But, you still are looking to get kids into the game for about a half or more. Typically you will subs about midway through the first half and then they start the second half - possibly in different positions subbing off after 15-20 minutes (depending on length of the half). Obviously if the score is such that the game is decided at the half you can play the weaker players longer.

Again, take your kid’s team roster and figure it out. How can you play everyone for at least 1/2 the game and still give yourself the best chance to win the game.

This is also a continuing issue with the American pay to play system. Simply put; if you keep a kid on a team and take their money then they have to play. Don’t want to play a kid? Don’t put them on the team and don’t take the money. Easy.

Finally - showcase games are showcase games. Who plays the most there is based on who is showing up for recruiting purposes.

Anonymous wrote:One of my son's U10 travel coaches referred us to watch some videos of U10 teams playing in tournaments in Europe. These were the youth clubs of some of the big name clubs in Spain - Barcelona, Real Madrid, etc. I really have no idea how it works over there, but I guess this is the "elite" / MLSNext / ECNL whatever league for U-littles over there in Spain.

So my boys and I watched several games, and in particular we happened to watch the same U10 Barcelona team play against several different opponents. We were watching with an eye toward seeing the style of play and trying to learn from it.

One thing we noticed -- the kids were not rotated through different positions during the tournament: we saw the same kids playing defense game to game; the same kids in midfield game to game; the same offensive players game to game.

I have read other posts on here where others expressed their views about the importance of rotating kids through different positions, in order to make each player more well-rounded. While this sounds right to me, especially while the players are young, is this how they do it in Europe? It seems like this is another one of those "things to do for development" versus "things to do to win games" ... and I thought the big gripe about US youth soccer was that there was too much focus on winning games instead of development, and that the Europeans generally do it better.

But what do the Europeans do with players rotating in different positions at say, U10? Legit question for anyone who knows -- I honestly have no idea. Based on the little I've seen, they are already specializing players into different positions at a young age. They might be rotating them year to year, or month to month, or whatever, but they certainly aren't moving kids around during games or even during tournaments.

What are the sub rules? Free substitution? How many players play?

One reason to play players in different positions is if substitutions are limited.

OP what about goalkeeper. Was it the same player(s) I’m goal each time?

At u9/u10 you are not playing full field. So "position" aspects are pretty basic. Kids get 1v1 opportunities regardless of where they are playing. Give and goes, etc. . . More team aspects in games will be things like covering. Have a defender taking on a mid 1v1 -- who is rotating back to provide coverage? That type of thing.

As they get older -- positions get sorted based on abilities and physical attributes mostly. But -- and it is a very big But -- lots of kids can play lots of positions. So, some things come into play with the team make up. Got a solid player at every position (pretty rare even with very high level teams) then physical attributes will dictate positions more than anything.

My daughter played on very high level teams starting at 13. Even on those high level teams the weaker players ended up playing up top or wing mid positions as a way to get them playing time without too much risk of giving up goals. You might not score while they were on the field, but you could keep things in hand. The big thing in the American system is that everyone needs to play a lot in every game really. If you are charging parents to have their kid on the team, then you need to play them a decent amount in every game.

My daughter played 90 percent of the time as a wing defender on her club teams starting at about u14. Yet, every college coach that looked at her said -- "forward". In college she played anything that would get her on the field her freshman and sophomore years, and then "lucked" (good for her, bad for a teammate who got hurt) into defensive center mid which she then kept for her Junior and Senior years. But in college the coach is not looking to play everyone. Much more of the Euro approach.

So -- put yourself in the American youth coach's position. They need to play everyone. They would also like to win the game. Winning helps promote the club and themselves. Sit down with the roster and figure it out yourself. You need to get all of the kids into the game for at least a 1/2 and ideally more. Start with the weakest players. Where and when are you going to play them for at least a half, so that you stay competitive in the game?

Mind you -- I am not saying your weakest players are terrible. They likely are decent if it is a decent team, but it is all relative. They are the weakest players on the team, and if the competition is well below the level of your team as a whole -- then it does not matter. But if the competing team is equally or more skilled than your team -- then you still need to get these kids into the game for at least 1/2 the time. Where are they going to play so as they do the most help, and create less potential harm? Usually that is up top. You may not score, but you won't give up goals.

But -- my kid wants to play up top. They see weaker players playing up top. Why does my kid not get the same chance? Because if they put your kid up top and switched the weaker player to your kid's position what happens? Do you give up goals? If they answer to that question is likely, 'yes" then you have your answer.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If they were tournaments, isn't the expectation that kids are usually NOT rotated during tournaments, but usually play in their strongest position? Your videos of tournaments are not their daily reality.

We were at a club were everyone rotated. They would not do this during tournaments. They still rotate goalies but by 1/2. The coach would start off with one lineup but adjust players positions if they needed different skill sets vs other team’s players. So the girl who started as outside mid was moved to fullback to counter a striker who she matched up against better. The good thing was they could switch players in and out of any position. As they aged, the team could switch formations and positions on the fly.

Also no one was butt hurt if they were moved to a different position because everyone on the team moved positions.

Anonymous wrote:If they were tournaments, isn't the expectation that kids are usually NOT rotated during tournaments, but usually play in their strongest position? Your videos of tournaments are not their daily reality.

We were at a club were everyone rotated. They would not do this during tournaments. They still rotate goalies but by 1/2. The coach would start off with one lineup but adjust players positions if they needed different skill sets vs other team’s players. So the girl who started as outside mid was moved to fullback to counter a striker who she matched up against better. The good thing was they could switch players in and out of any position. As they aged, the team could switch formations and positions on the fly.

If they were tournaments, isn't the expectation that kids are usually NOT rotated during tournaments, but usually play in their strongest position? Your videos of tournaments are not their daily reality.

Anonymous wrote:One of my son's U10 travel coaches referred us to watch some videos of U10 teams playing in tournaments in Europe. These were the youth clubs of some of the big name clubs in Spain - Barcelona, Real Madrid, etc. I really have no idea how it works over there, but I guess this is the "elite" / MLSNext / ECNL whatever league for U-littles over there in Spain.

So my boys and I watched several games, and in particular we happened to watch the same U10 Barcelona team play against several different opponents. We were watching with an eye toward seeing the style of play and trying to learn from it.

One thing we noticed -- the kids were not rotated through different positions during the tournament: we saw the same kids playing defense game to game; the same kids in midfield game to game; the same offensive players game to game.

I have read other posts on here where others expressed their views about the importance of rotating kids through different positions, in order to make each player more well-rounded. While this sounds right to me, especially while the players are young, is this how they do it in Europe? It seems like this is another one of those "things to do for development" versus "things to do to win games" ... and I thought the big gripe about US youth soccer was that there was too much focus on winning games instead of development, and that the Europeans generally do it better.

But what do the Europeans do with players rotating in different positions at say, U10? Legit question for anyone who knows -- I honestly have no idea. Based on the little I've seen, they are already specializing players into different positions at a young age. They might be rotating them year to year, or month to month, or whatever, but they certainly aren't moving kids around during games or even during tournaments.

1. The players are far more technical at a younger age than we are. It is an expectation at that level of club.
2. If a coach tells a player that they need to work on something, they do it or they are gone. The coaches are smart and the players and if a player cannot be developed they will cut bait. A player may get a second chance at another high level academy but if the player has a weakness a tone club and it is not addressed at the other the result will be the same.
3. Rotating a player through multiple positions during a weekend tournament does not improve a players tactical IQ. Players all have various attributes and skills that lend themselves to various natural positions. Some positions lend themselves to taking advantage of those current attributes while simultaneously building towards other possible positions in the future as kids grow and change.

Think of baseball. You don't need to play every position to understand the game better. Kids have certain attributes that lend them to their natural position. You don't put the short kid at first base, you don't put the short arm kid at third base. You don't put your best fielder in left field.

So what you are likely seeing in a U10 tournament in Spain is coaches wisely playing to their players strengths in game while working on their weaknesses away from the game during the week over a longer period of time. Development should not solely be focused on a players weaknesses and those weaknesses should be worked on by the player on their own away from practice if possible. And even then, unless it is a glaring weakness it is debatable how much time should be spent on it. But I can assure you, there is no La Masia coach telling any player to juggle or do wall ball because the kids that need that are not even considered in the first place.

One of my son's U10 travel coaches referred us to watch some videos of U10 teams playing in tournaments in Europe. These were the youth clubs of some of the big name clubs in Spain - Barcelona, Real Madrid, etc. I really have no idea how it works over there, but I guess this is the "elite" / MLSNext / ECNL whatever league for U-littles over there in Spain.

So my boys and I watched several games, and in particular we happened to watch the same U10 Barcelona team play against several different opponents. We were watching with an eye toward seeing the style of play and trying to learn from it.

One thing we noticed -- the kids were not rotated through different positions during the tournament: we saw the same kids playing defense game to game; the same kids in midfield game to game; the same offensive players game to game.

I have read other posts on here where others expressed their views about the importance of rotating kids through different positions, in order to make each player more well-rounded. While this sounds right to me, especially while the players are young, is this how they do it in Europe? It seems like this is another one of those "things to do for development" versus "things to do to win games" ... and I thought the big gripe about US youth soccer was that there was too much focus on winning games instead of development, and that the Europeans generally do it better.

But what do the Europeans do with players rotating in different positions at say, U10? Legit question for anyone who knows -- I honestly have no idea. Based on the little I've seen, they are already specializing players into different positions at a young age. They might be rotating them year to year, or month to month, or whatever, but they certainly aren't moving kids around during games or even during tournaments.