Reply to Harvard faculty vote to limit A grades to no more than 20% of the class

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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]Anybody who does A work needs to get an A on their transcript. Doing otherwise means the grades are meaningless.

What grades others get has nothing to do with my grade. [/quote]

Most people do not produce true A work. The average grade should be a 3.0. Only those very much above average should get a 4.0. Grade inflation is bad for everyone [/quote]

What's your evidence for this? Why should an average grade be a 3.0. Clearly your education didn't teach you to make arguments coherently.[/quote]

Because a B grade is historically defined as "above average" and "good" work.  90% of students can't be above average in the real world.[/quote]

Your education didn't teach you the difference between an opinion or a fact either.   Grades can be normative (where students receive grades relative to the performance of their fellow students) or fixed (attainment of some pre-determined learning standards.)

Both grading options have their strengths and weaknesses. Grading on a curve at Harvard is rough.  Brown writes that 47% of its students were valedictorian or salutatorian of their HS class.  It's probably well above that at Harvard.[/quote]

+1 I hate to burst your bubble, but 90% of students at Harvard are academically "above average."  If they've shown mastery of learning standards for the course, there doesn't need to be an artificial curve such that only 20% of them can get As.  They shouldn't be penalized just because they're with a much smarter cohort than the average university.

[/quote]

Back in the day, my STEM major courses at an elite school were curved, which definitely limited the number of A's to even fewer than the 20% that Harvard is currently proposing. And all the students admitted to this university had top grades and standardized test scores. And yet, rarity of As was fine, because it was not the expectation that everyone got A's just for showing up and doing an average job compared to your classmates, even if it on a very difficult exam. The times I did earn As were noteworthy, because I knew I had accomplished something special.

Rampant grade inflation actually hurts many students. Graduate schools, law/med schools, recruiters etc. can no longer distinguish who the exceptional students are, and everyone's A average is now basically worthless. This forces students to try and stand out in other ways, all of which are even more stress inducing than working to earn good grades. [/quote]

I am not disagreeing that grades should reflect actual knowledge and competency. If a student has not mastered the material, then that should not be rewarded with a high grade. What does not make sense to me is imposing a quota or forced distribution on grades because that introduces something artificial into the evaluation process. If competency has genuinely been achieved, then it should be recognized with the appropriate grade regardless of whether the neighboring student is also competent.[/quote]

I think we disagree about whether an A should mean competency vs excellence. I expect everyone with a college degree to be competent. But I still want a way to reward unusual excellence. When an A simply means "competent" you completely lose the ability distinguish or reward those students who are remarkable. [/quote]

Actually, I think both of us agree on the fact that an A should be meaningful.

What I disagree with is artificially putting a quota on any grades.  A teacher should be able to give B's or C's or fail the entire class, if deem the case.

Let's say the engineering professor gives what she believes is a very difficult exam where she expects most students to get 50% correct.  However, if 30% rise to the occasion and got 90%+ on this exam, then I don't think I need to give B's to some of these students.  I believe this group of kids deserve an A's.  It is on me, as the faculty member, to provide an exam that is rigorous enough to challenge the students and delineate their understanding.[/quote]

Without a school-wide policy, it is very difficult for any individual professor to grade rigorously. Professors who give fewer As will see fewer students in their classes and get worse student reviews. I realize that there are marginal cases where artifically capping As could produce unfair results, but the current system has resulted in all professors having to drop their stnadards to give most student As. That's not tenable either.[/quote]

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