Reply to I’m a liberal democrat horrified by the current Dr Seuss drama and normalization of censorship

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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]

Exactly! You are well within your rights to criticize the decision. And I fully support that right.

But when posters like OP say this is "censorship" (not you, I think), that isn't a matter of opinion. That is factually wrong. [/quote]
That may be technically true, but part of the problem here is that this is now a widespread cultural phenomenon.  Many people say "times change" and that's true, but this change is so new that we don't have a widely accepted word for it yet.  Calling it "publisher's rights" doesn't capture it because it isn't really about their rights and it's way bigger than just publishing.  "Cancel culture" is a better term, but that's too perjorative.  What do you think it is? [/quote]

So a publisher cancelling their own books is "cancel culture?"

How about you take over the publishing of money-losing books and start subsidizing the publisher?[/quote]
I really doubt they were losing money.  Those books cost nothing to print and sales were low but steady.  Furthermorez they actually purpose was to keep Seuss's books in print. Plus they said that they cancelled book because the specific images were racist.  So why are you making up a story that this was strictly a money decision?

As I said, "cancel culture" is not a good term.  But we have no other term for "removing a statement or image from social circulation due to the perception of racism, whether voluntarily or involuntarily."

Whatever that is, it's less than 10 years old and growing fast.  They were isolated cases before that.  There were other reasons things get "cancelled." But this particular reason and social process is new.[/quote]

Why do you consider voluntary acts part of cancel culture? Isn't the point of cancel culture that the person or company faces negative consequences - boycotts, mean Tweets, etc - if they don't stop engaging in behavior that others find problematic?

Unless you can point to any evidence that the Seuss family was pressured into taking these books out of circulation, all of this handwringing about Dr Seuss' books being cancelled is just another culture war wedge issue contrived by Republicans. Voluntarily taking books with racist caricatures out of circulation because they do not honor Dr Seuss' legacy is hardly an example of cancel culture.[/quote]
Forget the name!  Look at the definition.  That's new.  Simply unheard of ten years ago.  Nobody did that.  That's why we still print Mein Kampf and you can buy it on Ebay.  It's the most racist book in history. Nobody ever thought to cancel it.[/quote]

You're missing the point. I'm not picking nits about the name, I'm talking about the distinction between caving to pressure from an outside group, and voluntarily making a decision that happens to dovetail with [b]current cultural norms.[/b] I don't know how you could possibly make the argument that they're remotely the same thing.[/quote]
They are not current.  They are proposed norms.  Accepted by some and not others.  And being hotly debated too. [/quote]

They are current, because they reflect our culture's shifting tastes. Racist caricatures were commonplace 60 years ago, because nobody thought twice about who it might hurt. Now, things are different, and that's okay!

And patently argument that racist caricatures being unacceptable is "hotly debated," but I guess that's why we're on page 55 of this thread.[/quote]
Long before I got on thos thread other people were arguing about it and claiming that all the other people who were complaining about this decision were suffering from faux outrage and had nothing to complain about.  Then you all complained about me.   For a non existent argument with nothing to complain about, you all sure argue a lot.  [/quote]

Because you're lamenting the excesses of cancel culture (which is not the case here) and the lack of objectivity in cultural norms (which has never been the case), which is a silly argument and a dumb hill to die on, but whatever floats your boat dude. Have a good weekend.[/quote]
Nope, that's not the hill I am standing on.  I'm standing on a totally differently hill watching you throw rocks at other people and suggesting that why might want to consider the real reason you throw such rocks.[/quote]

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