Reply to Jesus' Historicity

Forum Index » Religion

Reply to "Jesus' Historicity"

Subject:

Emoticons





More smilies

Text Color: Font: Close Marks

[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]With his alleged birthday coming up, let's discuss the person that is being celebrated. Present your information and argument for Jesus, fact or fiction.[/quote]

Jesus would be disgusted by MAGA

Jesus was a socialist

The Gospels were written long after Jesus's death and are unreliable, contradictory, and heavily influenced by theological agendas rather than historical accuracy

Some theories suggest that the Jesus story was created by combining elements from various pre-Christian pagan mystery cults, such as Mithras and Osiris

[/quote]

The popular claims that Jesus is “just a retelling” of Mithras or Osiris/Horus come almost entirely from 19th- and early-20th-century fringe books and modern internet memes, not from mainstream scholarship in classics, Egyptology, or the study of religion.

Scholarly consensus:

Classicists (Roger Beck, Manfred Clauss, Richard Gordon) and historians of Roman religion: The Roman Mithras cult has no crucifixion, no resurrection, no 12 disciples, no virgin birth, no “rising on the third day.”

Egyptologists (Jan Assmann, Erik Hornung, Mark Smith): The Osiris–Isis–Horus myth is a story of royal succession, death, and underworld rule, not a dying-and-rising savior who atones for humanity’s sins and offers personal salvation through faith.

New Testament scholars (Bart Ehrman, Paula Fredriksen, etc.): While there are broad typological parallels that any ancient Mediterranean dying-and-rising deity shares (death → new life), the specific Jesus–Mithras/Horus parallels almost all collapse under examination.

Where the internet myths came from
-Gerald Massey (1907), Kersey Graves (1875), and Tom Harpur (2004) – books that are not cited by any university department of classics or Egyptology.
-The 2007 viral film Zeitgeist, which copied many of those 19th-century claims verbatim and added new errors.
-Acharya S (D.M. Murdock) and similar modern mythicists.

There are some very broad, generic parallels that apply to dozens of ancient deities (a god associated with fertility dies and comes back in some form; spring festivals; sacred meals, etc.). But the detailed, specific story of Jesus (virgin birth in Bethlehem, ministry with 12 disciples, crucifixion under Pontius Pilate, bodily resurrection on the third day witnessed by named individuals, etc.) has no close structural parallel in the Mithras or Osiris cults according to the surviving ancient evidence and modern scholarship.

Claim You Often Hear Online:

Born of a virgin on December 25

False. Mithras is born fully-grown from solid rock (petra genetrix). No mother, no virginity issue.

False. False. Osiris/Horus is conceived normally by Nut and Geb; Horus by Isis and the re-assembled Osiris.

Mother named Mary / Maia

False. Mithras has no mother at all.
False: Isis is the mother of Horus, but her name is never “Mary.”

Had 12 disciples

False. Mithras has no disciples; initiates belong to seven grades (Raven, Bride, Soldier, Lion, etc.).

False. Horus has four semi-divine sons or “followers” in some funerary texts, not 12.

Performed miracles, healed the sick

Mithras: Almost no evidence. One late relief might show water miraculously springing from rock, but very rare.

Osiris: Horus does fight Set and has magical contests, but not a ministry of healing the sick and blind.

Crucified / died and rose after 3 days

Mithras: False. Mithras never dies in the Roman cult. He ascends to heaven alive after a banquet with Sol.

Osiris: Osiris is murdered, dismembered, and reassembled; he becomes ruler of the underworld, not earth. Horus never dies.

Resurrection celebrated at Easter / spring

Mithras: False. The main Mithraic festival was 25 December (Natalis Invicti), not a resurrection feast.

Osiris: Egyptian festivals for Osiris were in autumn (Khoiak); spring was more associated with vegetation gods like Adonis or Attis.

Called “the Good Shepherd,” “Lamb,” etc.

Mithras: False. Mithras is never called a shepherd or lamb.

Osiris: Osiris is sometimes linked to grain/vegetation, but not a shepherd or lamb.

Last meal with disciples before ascending

Mithras: A sacred banquet (often shown with Sol) is repeated regularly; not a one-time “last supper.”

Osiris: No last-meal motif.

Don’t get your information from memes. It never ends well.

[img]<a href="https://imgbb.com/"><img src="https://i.ibb.co/sd0FL5TS/IMG-3706.webp"  ></a>
<a href="https://ibb.co/VcTH22Nc"><img src="https://i.ibb.co/cSQbDDvS/IMG-3707.jpg"  ></a>
<a href="https://ibb.co/6JsV4Qyv"><img src="https://i.ibb.co/848Tjkmz/IMG-3708.jpg"  ></a>[/img][/quote]

Options

	Disable HTML in this message
	Disable BB Code in this message
	Disable smilies in this message

Review message

Search Recent Topics Hottest Topics