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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]What is it about this animal that makes it to the forbidden fruit list?
What was the reasoning back in the day?[/quote]People even now get sick every year eating shellfish and undercooked pork. People have died.

Back in biblical times, there were no microwaves to nuke the parasites and harmful bacteria in creatures which eat filth, feces, or feast on the dead. These animals God declared unclean to eat.

Similarly, God said not to wear mixed fabrics. Back in those days, there were no powerful detergents, no hot water rinse or steam cycles to destroy fleas and lice which hide and lay eggs in the gap between the two fabrics.

Note that there was no death sentence for eating unclean foods or wearing mixed fabrics but there was a death sentence for rape of a betrothed woman, homosexuality, and adultery. 
 [/quote]

And slavery!  That was endorsed also!  Don’t forget slavery![/quote]

I hear you. But ancient slavery was very different than industrial chattel slavery like in the American South[/quote]

Different how?

Both involved owning people.

Your position is the one used by people trying to justify it.  Here’s a suggestion: don’t do that!  It is never OK to own another person, under any circumstances, and never has been.  It’s immoral.  Can’t we agree on that?[/quote]
dp.. I've been a life long Christian and struggled with a lot of stuff in the Bible.

I now attend a fairly liberal church, and this is how the pastor explained it...

The Bible and those who wrote the letters (ie Paul) did so in the culture of their time, which included owning slaves, and subjugating women.   Jesus didn't come to change the culture. He came to spread the Good News. IMO, He did not care about the culture or politics, which is why He didn't rail against Roman rule, nor did He claim to come to free people from Roman rule.

You have to read  the Bible in the context and time period in which it was written.    Slaves obey your masters; wives submit to t heir husbands.. these were all about keeping the peace and order in society.  It was not about Jesus' teachings.

For example, child brides were not uncommon back in Biblical times, but we would never ok that. However, if you look at some fundamentalist extreme religions, they still think the practice of child brides is acceptable.

The principle of the Bible hasn't changed, but the day to day living has.

I used to belong to a conservative church, and they don't believe in drinking alcohol, yet Jesus drank wine.  The way they explained it was that in the time, they had to drink wine because they didn't have clean water.  But, we do today, so we shouldn't drink wine.  But, they still believed in subjugating women.
 
People use all kinds of reasoning to support their beliefs.[/quote]

I notice how you didn't - nor did anyone else - say the proper answer, which is this:

IT IS NEVER MORAL TO OWN A PERSON, AND THE BIBLE SHOULD SAY THAT.

That's really it.  It's not debatable, and separate from the "god not existing" question. The fact that none of you jump to that conclusion should show you how much Kool-Aid you have consumed.  To the point where you defend the indefensible.

But no statement like that from you or your bible.  Plenty on graven images, paying taxes and wearing mixed fabrics, but no declaration that human beings should not be personal property.

If it were any other religion than your own you'd lose your flippin' minds over it.[/quote]
Morality is subjective.  Of course, we find slavery to be immoral today. But, that wasn't the case back then.  All cultures had some form of slavery in their history.  The Bible was written in ancient times, when many cultures had slavery.

You are looking at the Bible through the lens of today's morals.   That's a mistake that even Christians make.[/quote]

Lol.  So your position is the bible is not a reference for morality today?  Wow, we 100% agree on that.  But that means none of it is, you don't get to pick and choose.

Christians now claiming there is no objective morality from God.  What's the world coming to?[/quote]
It's clear that you do not understand religion or the Bible.

The only morals from God are the 10 commandments, the Golden Rule, and Jesus teachings.  That is why Jesus did not touch on certain subjects. He did not care about culture or politics.

Everything else was based on the culture of the time.  People weave their subjective morals into their religion. That is not just a Christian thing.   Most of the Christian holidays and traditions were basically an amalgamation of local culture and Christianity.   Dec 25 is not actually Jesus birthday.  Christians hijacked that day from the pagans who celebrated winter solstice. There are lots of examples like this. It doesn't make the day any less special since we don't really know the exact date Jesus was born, so picking a day and celebrating is as good as it gets.

Please go take religion class.
[/quote]

What you have done is called "ad hominem", which means attacking the messenger instead of addressing the message. I get why you would do that, as you have taken an absolutely indefensible position - defending slavery.  In your position, it was OK back then.  In mine, it was not. And FYI I've taken plenty of religion classes, and read many books on the subject.

Also, are you claiming that people do not try to use the bible to enforce their morality on others today?  Using Leviticus and other chapters than the ones you mention? Please don't tell me you think that.  Or I else I would have to respond in kind and ask you to read a newspaper.  [/quote]

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