Reply to That Brock Allen Turner is a dirtbag

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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]I think the PP's comparison to drunken driving is apt. Someone who kills a person while driving drunk may not be an evil human being or a risk to others generally speaking. But most of us would agree that being intoxicated doesn't absolve you of responsibility for any harm done while you're behind the wheel.

On that basis, it seems like the Stanford guy should be held responsible for any and all crimes he committed while intoxicated, even if he's unlikely to do anything like that ever again and even if it was the alcohol that impaired his judgment.

But I agree with some of the PPs about the responsibility of the woman in this situation. Not legal responsibility of course, but personal responsibility. Her impaired judgment played a huge role in what happened to her, and her choices caused that impaired judgment. (As opposed to someone who is drugged without their knowledge or someone who is mentally impaired.)

Anyone who gets hit by a bus is a victim, and deserves sympathy as well as justice. But if you were high or drunk out of your mind and wandering in the middle of the street, you are partially responsible for what has happened to you. Getting blackout drunk isn't the same thing as wearing a short skirt.

I say that as someone who did a lot of stupid things in college, and I look at this woman and think there but for the grace of God....Hopefully all our kids, both boys and girls, will look at this story and take the lesson that binge drinking is a ticket to terrible, terrible situations.[/quote]

This is disgusting and ignorant.  I don't think anybody would agree that it was a great idea for her to be blackout drunk.  But that doesn't mean she deserved to be raped.  The problem here is not that she got drunk, it's that this guy thought he could rape her.  Rape is not okay.  Ever.  It's not excused.  Ever.  It's illegal.  Just because she was drunk does not then mean she should be raped.  She was a victim, you idiot.  If she's supposed to know better by not getting so drunk, why should he not know better than to commit a crime?  Rape is rape.  It's illegal.  Doesn't matter what the victim was doing.  Period.  She was raped.  Illegally.  Because rape is illegal.  I'm trying to get the point across by saying this multiple ways, but I don't think you'll get it anyway.[/quote]

No one said she *deserved* to be raped. Yes, obviously rape is wrong. But she chose to drink excessively and put herself in a vulnerable position. She has to at least take responsibility for that. It's more than a "bad idea" - it's being irresponsible with her own personal safety. 
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She chose to drink a lot.  But she didn't put herself in a "vulnerable situation," unless you are calling THE ENTIRE WORLD a vulnerable situation.  Women get raped drunk, sober, in their homes, in churches, on streets, at parties, in libraries, at sporting events, on public transportation, etc., etc., etc.  Where, exactly, would you like us to go?[/quote]

She passed out dead drunk behind a freakin' dumpster outside on a public street with a strange not so nice guy nearby.  Do not candy coat just how serious her poor judgement was.  [/quote]

Do you get how drinking works?  Do you get what state of mind you're in before you pass out?  Do you think she walked behind the dumpster stone sober and started doing shots?  She drank, too much, at a party.  Brock brought her behind the dumpster AFTER she was unable to consent.

But good news for you!  She was raped!  So was she adequately "punished" for her poor judgment?  Or should the swedes have hopped on too?[/quote]

I was a "party animal" myself back in the day.  I do understand what it means to be VERY drunk but still participating and still aware of what is happening and still wanting to participate in what is happening...even though you are very, VERY drunk.  A person that is NOT aware of what is happening, is not participating - is absolutely being assaulted.

[b]Me waking up behind a dumpster feeling lousy the next morning with a pounding headache, clothes pulled up/off and a lot of regret "WTF did I do???!!" [/b]does not automatically mean rape or sexual assault occurred.  But it might have occurred.  Maybe?  People don't go to jail for what might have happened.

In this situation with Emily Doe - it did occur.  Thank God for those Swedes.[/quote]

You get that this wasn't the case here, right?  She didn't fall asleep after having a good time behind a dumpster.  She was unconscious the whole time she was behind the dumpster.  If she merely fell asleep, she would've woken up when the Swedes were trying to wake her up, or when they transported her to the hospital, or when she was being medically evaluated, or when they changed her into scrubs, etc.

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Was she fully unconscious the whole time or just blacked out? And how do you know she wasn't conscious at some point behind the dumpster? I don't think we really know. 
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