Reply to The bible says homosexuality is a sin, right?

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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]A thought to mull over:

If Christ appeared today and preached the very same message he did 2000 years ago, how many of those who profess to believe in him and his teachings, would listen to him?[/quote]

A good question.[/quote]

I don't know the answer. There are plenty of historical figures who opposed injustice based on their Christianity; I like to think they would listen to Jesus now. Many fundamentalist Christians don't seem to think of Jesus as a radical activist for social justice, but that's what he was. Similarly, [b]many atheists dismiss Jesus as an activist and completely overlook the Christians who drove the abolition movement in the U.S. or died in concentration camps for actively opposing Hitler.[/b] Go figure.
[/quote]

I like to think those people acted as they did because they were good people (Christians or not) who were doing what was right for humanity -- not simply because the deity they worshipped would guarantee a place in heaven for them if they followed the example set forth for them in an ancient book, and who would otherwise send them to hell[/quote]

You have your own "beliefs" about what motivated these people, then, and according to your "beliefs," religion couldn't have played a role, also religion is only about the fear of hell. However, if you asked them, though, they'd probably tell you that their innate moral sense and their religious beliefs were acting in concert, in fact their religious beliefs informed their sense of morality and justice.[/quote]

No according to my "beliefs"  [b]it wasn't necessary for religion to play a role. [/b] some people were motivated by their religious beliefs, but others without those beliefs and/or with different beliefs,were motivated to do the same things, because they were simply good, humanistic things to do -- that's the "innate moral sense" you mention - beliefs in a supernatural deity with a set of ancient rules attached to it are not needed for this.[/quote]

You're actually a great example of conflict between the facts and your own beliefs. I second the other PP in suggesting that you read up on [b]historical figures (abolitionists, Civil Rights workers, Ghandi, others) who wrote and spoke eloquently about the importance of religion in guiding their moral values.[/b] Key here is that they talk about how their motivation came from the religious values themselves, not just the fear of hell that you want to use as a convenient way to dismiss religion. You simply can't "choose to believe" that religion played no role, or merely a negative role (fear), in these peoples' lives.[/quote]

I'm saying that these motivations are basically humanistic, irrespective of the religious garb that covers them.    The message is that all humans should be treated with respect.  Jesus said something like that -- so did revered figures from other religions.  But religions can also include a lot of conflicting beliefs are are not humanistic and are in fact cruel.  It's the common humanistic beliefs that positively motivate religious people to do good for others.[/quote]

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