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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]
 
Ehh, at best they will retain Crimea, and portions of what they currently hold.  At worst, they will collapse.

I still question if Putin will survive if the people ever actually learn the truth of how many Russians were pointlessly sent to die in the meat grinder without training, without adequate equipment, and so on.  When they realize that what had once been the world's second most powerful and feared military was robbed by Putin and his oligarch buddies.  That Russia has become a [b]pariah state[/b].[/quote]

DP.  I was quite happy to sit back and read all the "experts" weigh in on this, but seriously????  Hope you're not a U.S. policymaker or in leadership.

[img]https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2023/01/18/10/66698107-11647931-Putin_has_now_deployed_Russia_s_fearsome_S_400_defence_missiles_-m-10_1674036795675.jpg[/img]

"One S-400 air defence system, which has a range of 248 miles, has been deployed in fields belonging to the Russian State Agricultural University in the [b]northwest[/b] of Moscow.
Another has been deployed to the Losiny Ostrov National Park near Sokolniki district in the [b]northeast[/b] of the city.
The S-400 is capable of shooting down up to 80 targets simultaneously and is said to be able to travel at a speed of more than 10,000mph."
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11647931/Putin-deploys-air-defence-systems-Moscow-amid-fears-Ukrainian-strikes-capital.html

Isn't Ukraine West by Southwest of Moscow?  What do you think this is positioned for?  Hmm.  I wonder.

"Its purpose is the protection of civil and military point and area targets, for motorised or mechanised troops up to regimental size or as defensive asset of higher ranking air defence systems like S-300/S-400. The system has capability for anti-munitions missions. 
Additional missiles, one specifically designed to engage unmanned aerial vehicles, and [b]another one hypersonic, developing speeds of more than Mach 5,[/b] have been developed for the Pantsir system."
On 19 January 2023, pictures posted online show that a Pantsir air defence system has been placed on two buildings in Moscow. Including the [b]Russian Ministry of Defence and the Ministry of Education[/b]. Such a deployment of point defence systems is not unheard of, the US government uses NASAMS and Avenger systems to protect Washington D.C., [b]this is the first time they have been deployed in Moscow[/b]. 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pantsir_missile_system

I wonder why you'd need a short-range hypersonic surface-to-air missile deployed on Moscow rooftops and not somewhere between Ukraine and Moscow?  Hmm.  It must be to shoot down all those hypersonic Ukrainian drones buzzing all the chicks at Gorky Park.. yeah..  that's it.

"Z" can stand for Zapad, but I think the Atlantic put it best in this article:

"An Army of Zombies is leading us to Hell"
https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2022/09/russia-exile-putin-military-draft/671541/

You really don't understand what's happening at all.  In wars where many people die, the population becomes desensitized to death.  They stop caring about anything.  They stop resisting.  There is no logic or empathy anymore.  That void has been filled with ruthlessness and despair.  From Putin's perspective, the more that die the better.  It helps cement their resolve.

I hope I'm wrong, but I don't think I am?

[/quote]

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