Reply to Why do European women have no children?

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[quote=Anonymous][quote]#1  What is on TV now, versus the 1950s?  What is on the cover of magazines, in movies?  What about rates of divorce, suicide, drug and alcohol abuse, child abuse, child pornography, pornography use, out of wedlock births, abortion, sexual assault, unfaithfulness?  None of these things are new, but we sure are more coarse about them.[/quote]

Do you have any assertion that these things are higher now than then (I'll grant you out of wedlock births and abortion) other than your feelings and the 24-hour news cycle blaring them out at every turn? (I'd also challenge your assertion that pornography use is in se harmful.)

[quote]#2  Men have always tended towards selfishness.  But now they have different reasons to indulge.  Sexism has new tools.  [/quote]

I'm guessing you're not the one who said Victorian prostitution was a-ok since it gave men an outlet for casual sex. I'll leave alone your assertion than men are selfish since that cannot be proven or disproven.

[quote]#3  Coercive "family planning" policies happen all over the globe, not just China.  But it's not just government programs.  It's societal attitudes.  Children shift from gifts to burdens, accidents, mistakes, choices--their value is tied to their "wantedness," their usefulness, rather than intrinsic.  They need to prove their worth to their parents and to society.  Are they "planned"?  Healthy?  Well-provided for?  A boy and a girl, no more?  Do they fit with their parents' desire for travel, eating out frequently, frenetic work schedules?  This shift of thinking is profound, and goes way beyond government-forced sterilizations and abortions.[/quote]

So pop out as many kids as possible, regardless of the consequences to family life, access to higher education, etc.? Is that all we are, machines to produce children? Is a woman to be defined by how many kids she can birth? (I notice you glide over my statement that sex-selection abortions are an application of traditional values, ones I'm guessing you don't adhere to.)

[quote]#4  Sparta was one tiny society.  The global impact of dehumanization, combined with technology, is far more profound, and takes their primitive way of thinking to an unfathomable level.  Babies can be created and destroyed, harvested and utilized, cultivated and bred, tested and eliminated, all well before birth.  People become parts, not persons.[/quote]

Infanticide was the norm through human history through most cultures (the Jews were regarded as weird for not doing it). Today we just do it at 8-12 weeks gestation; acceptance of 2nd and 3rd trimester abortions decreases greatly. In fact, 2nd/3rd trimester abortions are probably more regulated in Europe than here.

[quote]But separating sex and procreation corrupts something fundamental to our humanity.[/quote]

This separation has been attempted through history, as I'm sure you well know.

Since World War II, there's been a steady decline in the number of people killed by warfare every decade. Disease has decreased. Life expectancies have increased. [/quote]

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