Reply to 15-yo DS Opens Car Door for a Girl

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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]My boys (now young adults) always hold the doors open for women.  They’ll also offer their seats, stand when a woman approaches them, etc.  It has nothing to do with women not being capable of doing so. It’s simply a demonstration of respect.  They do the same for older people.  [/quote]

My husband holds the door open for just about everyone. So does my brother. I do too -- I'm a woman but ES taught to hold doors, open car doors, offer to carry packages etc. for elderly people, female or male. Because...manners. And extra attention to the elderly. Or guests. Or just friends.

The angry "women don't need doors held for them!" folks seem threatened and insulted by those who would offer respect. I guess it's seen as disrespectful or infantilizing. It's not coming from that place at all -- unless you choose to put that interpretation on it. But that's coming from those PPs, not from the door-openers. 
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Respect is something that is mutual. It is not respect when it is something that that is only one way and that perpetuates the stereotype that women are weak, helpless and need a man for basic tasks. If I am entering a door, I always look behind and hold it for man, woman, or child. As a woman I am perfectly fine with a man, woman or child holding open a door for me. I am not okay with my daughter standing by a car waiting for a boy to come open her door or a boy rushing around to open her car door for her.  That isn't respect unless she is also going to get out and run around and open his door.

Women will never be seen as equals or move up into senior positions as long as we treat them so differently than boys. Manners are something that you should teach all your children, male and female and that apply to everyone. Respect goes both ways, both boys and girls are deserving of respect and should treat others with respect. As soon as you make it one directional and this is just something you teach boys to do...it is sexist.

Teach your daughters that they are as capable as men. [/quote]

You get pretty wound up about this.

No wonder so many guys are confused.  [b]What used to be simple manners is now sexist.  [/b]

My son will sometimes open the door for his girlfriend, even though she is more than capable of doing it herself.

[/quote]

I am not wound up at all. I think this has been a pretty rational, calm discussion by DCUM standards with varying points of view being expressed pretty respectfully. I think the sentence I bolded is true. In the past the general societal view of women meant that men were taught to do things for women - that despite being well intended - were still sexist. Women were seen as unable to do many of the things that men could so men very kindly helped them and did for them all the things that they couldn't do because they were women. Now that many of us see women as being able to do many things themselves, those kind gestures that were rooted in sexism are no longer really a good thing. I do agree it is confusing for men - [b]if they were taught - you need to do x,y, and z for women (just because they are women)[/b] and now women are saying, actually I don't need you to do that for me just because I am a woman - I can see it would be confusing for sure. Hopefully within a generation or two fewer men will be raised thinking they need to do x, y, and z for women - just because they are women and they will see women more as their equal. They will still be respectful and kind - in the same way though that they would be respectful and kind to other men.[/quote]

Pp you quoted here.

Re: the bolded.... Ds grew up with DH opening doors for me.  Not because I'm female.  I have mobility limitations and sometimes do need help.

I know ds doesn't always hold doors open.[/quote]

For sure. Doing something because someone needs help is completely different than doing something for someone just because of their gender. [/quote]

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