Reply to Be Wary of Racism and Islamophobes

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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]Okay, your next point...You said:

" That verse describes the proper treatment of women who were from pagan tribes yet wanted to be Muslims, and wanted to join Muslims at the place where they lived. Hence the very long list of requirements to prove that they were in fact Muslim. Why did women have to be perfect to make an oath? Did anyone apply these standards to men who wanted to make an oath of allegiance? "

Remember that an oath of allegiance may be given before the individual acquires power, as the individual has newly acquired power, or after the individual has held power for some time. In any of these situations, an oath of allegiance to become a new member of their tribe meant a vote for the individual to either acquire power or to retain power. The larger the volume of allegiances, the greater the individual's power. The important point is this verse gave women political relevance because it meant they could vote for a candidate or seek membership in Muhammad's state WITHOUT a male guardian speaking for them. It meant their independent oath carried the same political relevance as a man's. If this kind of right or political relevance was already granted to women in most other cultures, states, or religious systems at the time, then please provide the scriptural proof as we have done here with the Quran.

And if this verse is still not clear enough evidence for you that Islam made women politically relevant, then verse 38 of Ash Shurra should since it uses plural language and states believers should decide all relevant matters collectively through mutual consultation.

As for why the list is long or your implication thats its unreasonable or whether it only applied to women are different issues unrelated to the topic of women's voting. [/quote]
I am afraid I have to disagree. It is VERY relevant why a woman seeking to join Muslims would have to prove all kinds of things before her allegiance was accepted. It was clearly not enough to just be female to be eligible to vote (if you consider this voting).  One had to meet all kinds of other standards.

And to bring in the historical context, remember that the conflict during which this verse was revealed not between Muslims and Muslims, but rather between Muslims in Medina and pagans in Mecca. As the founder of any new religion, Muhammad was interested in expanding its ranks.  The unspoken context of admitting "believing women" (from Mecca) was that these women had to have embraced Islam on their own WITHOUT their pagan Meccan husbands or male guardians (otherwise they would have tried to move to Medina with their husbands rather than by themselves.) Islam does not recognize marriages between Muslim women and pretty much anyone else other than Muslim men.  A wife's conversion to Islam without accompanying conversion by her husband invalidates the marriage temporarily, and invalidates it completely if the husband refuses to convert. So the context of "believing women" migrating to Medina (from Mecca) without male guardians was that their male guardians at the time would have been pagan, and thus in Islam's eyes, would have no right to guardianship over Muslim women. As such, these women do not have guardians per se if they are the only Muslims in their pagan families because Islam does not permit non-Muslim men to have guardianship over Muslim women. [/quote]

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