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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]What we do know is that sex abuse by Catholic clergy is at around the same rate as clergy in general.

But there is, generally no global institutional cover-up of sex abuse by teachers.[/quote]

The rate of rapist priest is one element. The other is the number of people engaged in a coverup, excuse-making, and hushing of rapist priests. The Catholic Church is basically a massive pedophile ring. that doesn't mean that lay people and ordinary Catholics are involved in that pedophile ring, but the institution functions as such as part of their operations, throughout their hierarchy. There is simply no other way to describe it other than a pedophile ring, with the level and lengthy history of transfers and cover up.

I was not brought up Catholic, but my mom was - and she was raped in her Catholic Church. Many ordinary Catholic people are decent people, but there's no way in hell you could get her to want to go back to such a fucked up institution. [/quote]

You mean there's corrupt people in the biggest bureaucratic institution in the world? Shocker. Kinda like the Teacher's Union and public school districts who cover up for all their incompetent, lazy, bullying, abusive teachers? Hope you don't send your kids to public schools. Oh wait, this is DC, I forgot, everyone sends their kids to elitist private schools/academies.[/quote]

Your attempt to make a (false) equivalence between corruption in covering up massive, long-histories of child rape in the Catholic church, and lazy teaching or union corruption, doesn't help the opinion of the Catholic Church as a pedophile ring - and that many Catholics (not all), still make excuses for their centuries-long (perhaps inception-long) history of raping children.

[/quote]
No, I'm just tired of hearing the same old tired, worn out, narrow minded attitude that an entire religious group who has done more charitable work than any other religious group in the world is ultimately nothing more than a scandalous pedophile ring. And dismissing the crime of one group of individuals while demonizing another is a double standard.  [/quote]

No, it's not a double standard. No one's saying that there's no rape and molestation of children by other religious groups or in other facets of community life. But for you to use those other examples (which are very, very different and without the same institutional manipulation and cover up) is a distraction to the Catholic Church's crimes. That you describe this as a "tired, worn out, narrow minded attitude" is seriously fucking appalling. I'm sorry to swear, but there's no other way to describe it. You're belittling it. You're not listening.

And sorry, but the the "more charitable work" argument is debatable, as a lot of things that some people deem as "charitable," are incredibly harmful and dangerous for local populations. I'm looking at you, proselytizing missionaries.

The more Catholics try and make distractions concerning the Catholic Church as a pedophile ring, the more they damage their reputation. Not all Catholics do that, but a lot do. Stop making excuses. [/quote]

You realize your casting a broad, bigoted, generalization about an entire religion, right? Would you do the same about Islam, because a similar bigoted generalization is that they are a religion of violence and hate?  [/quote]

Who's casting a generalization about an entire religion? I'm not talking about the people or even the theological beliefs. I'm talking about the institution, which, among it's functions, includes functioning as a pedophile ring. I come from a Muslim background (but am an atheist), and have plenty of criticism about Islam. But there's no institution in the religion. There's no head, no body, no organization. That may actually be a big structural flaw, but it does not in any way carry the same parallel concerning the institution of the Catholic Church's pedophile and child rape functions.  I'm disgusted that you think it's "bigoted" to call out and hold accountable the hierarchy and structure for their responsibility in standing by idly (at best), and underhandedly encouraging child rape (at worst). I think that says more about you, than it does me. Pointing that out is "bigoted?" What the hell is your mind? [/quote]

Dude, my point is that you're whole hatred for the Catholic religion is based on the infallible nature of man. Priests sin, bishops sin, cardinals sin, the pope sins. Man is imperfect. But the teachings of the Church, the foundations of faith and morals, the principles and teachings are greater than the sins of men within the institution. It's like you're hyper focused on one issue, while ignoring the beauty of the faith. Throwing out the baby with the bathwater. Not all priests/clergy committed these heinous crimes; in fact it's a small minority. Yet you're determined to demonize the entire institution/religion regardless of situation. If you're a hammer looking for nails, then all you're going to see are the nails. If you're so caught up on one aspect of how the Church fucked up, then you're only going to see that aspect of it. Live and let live man. [/quote]

Sure individuals in positions of authority over the laity were raping kids, then when discovered, the kids and parents were hushed up, and the priests shuttled off to new parishes where they could rape again, with no warning given to their new charges. And of course there were people in the Church hierarchy that orchestrated this scheme, and have faced no repercussions whatsoever, and to this day hold positions of prestige and power. But *that's* not the institution. Stop hyper-focusing on the century old, institutional child raping--focus on the "beauty" of the words these men are saying.

No thanks.[/quote]
Again, if we were having the same conversation about Islam, you would be considered a bigoted, ignorant, intolerant, prick. We get it, you hate the Catholic church, duly noted. But how about showing some respect for other people's religion/religious beliefs, and keep your bigoted, ignorant, intolerant comments to yourself? [/quote]

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