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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]Yes it can be, depression isn't a permanent 24/7/365 gloom. It's also concerning to have a loved one noting the long list of things you are doing "right or wrong". That relationship may have left her crippled in some way to deal with family doing checklist criticism. [b]You seem hyper judgmental [/b]and you are not seeing her daily.[/quote]

Not OP. This seems incorrect. I think OP cares about her sister. It's not like she is judging her. She is concerned for her sister who doesn't bathe, smells, can't keep a job and wants to date but isn't getting 2nd dates. OP asking for help in this case, to me, is her being caring. But I do agree that it is hard to help someone who doesn't want it.[/quote]

I'm someone who is a lot like OP's sister, although more functional.  I can pull it together for my job, but that pretty much uses all my spoons.

One thing that hurts is when the goalposts move.  If I worked really hard to show up clean, wearing clean well fitting clothing, and someone judged me because my clothes were stretchy (they always are) and I didn't have mascara on (I never have) and my hair wasn't colored (it never has been except once with koolaid for a Halloween costume), then I wouldn't think "Oh, I'll learn how to put on mascara", I'd think WTF is the point?

I think that identifying a couple concrete things, which to me would be showering, and figuring out if there is a medical cause such as depression, thyroid, apnea, for the sleep, is a huge ask.  And focusing on those, and not on all the other peieces, is appropriate.  [/quote]
I think this is a really good point about moving the goalposts. Very insightful from someone who knows what it's like. [/quote]

+1, that's a really good insight.

I am someone who could have been OP's sister but who wound up married by 35 which changed my trajectory some. I am also older and in the last decade or more have acquired a variety of tools that help with the mental health stuff that can make it hard for me to do the basic self care work OP's sister is struggling with. CBT was really, really important for me. But so was just trying different stuff and figuring out what works for me (that app OP mentioned sounds like a step in this direction, I use a variety of lists and incentives to make myself do the stuff I need to do). There was no single silver bullet, but it was like a combo of:

- therapy (different therapy with different therapists, most are only good for one of two things, I needed to work with different people to find stuff that works)

- lots of self help books, including like productivity books or books on career and socializing, as well as therapeutic books on depression, anxiety, CBT, DBT, etc. I read a book on having confidence. I read a book on dealing with friendship breakups. I got in the habit of looking for resources whenever I was having a hard time. My google history involves lots of stuff like "what to do when you are too depressed to go to work" or "can I buy something right now for less than $50 that will make me feel less sad" or "do other people have icky feelings that come over them and just ruin everything." I still do this. It helps. The act of looking for something that helps, helps

- having hobbies and friends. Like I said, I got married and that changed the course of things (for better in some ways, but it's harder in other ways -- you just wind up with different challenges than when you are single). But even beyond that, you just have to have people to hang out with and things to do, little goals to work on, etc. Sounds like OP's sister is actually doing well on this front, I think that's a great sign even if some of the other stuff is hard right now. People with friends and hobbies tend to be forward-looking, being forward looking is a great antidote to depression.[/quote]

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