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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]Simple. Meets ALL of the following criteria

Within the first five ranks in a class size of over 500
Scores of over 1550 SAT or 35 ACT in a single attempt. No super scoring. 
Scores 5 in most of the 8 or more AP tests taken
Scores of over 750 in every one of Subject tests if taken

Very likely around 5,000-10,000 max such students in the whole country. So not many  You could easily accommodate every one of them in the top ten schools.  But then the diversity goals of the schools would be violated, so they are rejected routinely in favor of  less academically accomplished students through all kinds of twisted rationalizations. [/quote]

As someone who used to be an academic star in high school back when tutoring wasn't so prevalent, when I read your list, my mind mentally automatically adds up the hours/$$ of tutoring/prep and the parental involvement for most of the kids on your list to achieve those "accomplishments."
Yes, some will have done it naturally. They are the real thing. Others were hoisted there, going past others who may not have had that support. It's a game now and I don't take the things you list at face value anymore. 
[/quote]

This 1000%

Most are not that way thru no assistance.  Back when most of us attended HS, tutoring was not a thing, unless you were really struggling and then it was the struggling kid sitting at the HS after hours with the NHS students providing tutoring for free. Nobody with A's and B's got "tutoring"---you worked with your friends and figured out how to do the homework.  (or in my case, I did the math and science homework on the phone with 1 or 2 friends and they disseminated it to the rest of the class as I didn't have the time or interest to explain it to everyone multiple times).  We took the SAT once.  You either took the SAT or ACT based on where you lived---rarely did you take both (I took both cause I lived in a state where SAT was the one and I wanted to apply to colleges in the midwest where they wanted ACTs).  You got your score and you submitted it.  Taking the PSAT in 11th grade (and 11th grade only) was "the preparation" for the SAT.  
We took AP courses (only had 2 offered) and then took the test, with minimal preparation.  The really smart ones got 4 or 5s---the rest got 2 or 3s.

But even back then, elite schools still had many kids who had 1300s and good gpa but not 4.0.  What was similar across most students was the motivation and drive to succeed, except it was more natural and not driven by the parents and rat race of getting into college.  I attended a T10 school, it was filled with smart, motivated kids.  But it was genuine motivation and drive.   THat's not what I see now at those schools or with most of the kids who get in---most are in the cog of doing everything in hopes of getting into the right college, not because they want to learn 
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