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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]The Catholic Church is a cult that systematically abuses children and pays to cover it up.

Shame on all practicing Catholics. Shame on you.[/quote]

DH was raised Catholic, and he calls it a cult. Loathes it, and thinks all should quit the church because of it's association with and history of child abuse. A sick, sick underbelly to that religion. [/quote]

There are more than 1.3 billion (with a “b”) Catholics in the world. You think they’re responsible for the predations of a comparatively few perverts and the acts and/or omissions of bad administrators?  That’s like saying the Chinese people are responsible for the evils of Communism, or the Cambodians for the evils of Pol Pot. The vast majority of those 1.3 billion people, although sinners, are doing their best to find their way through this life and into what they hope will be eternal life according to a belief system in which they find solace and hope. Those 1.3 billion people perform untold hidden works of charity.  The “Church” isn’t the administrative entity — that entity exists to serve (sometimes very poorly) the needs of those 1.3 billion people.

How dare PP “shame” 1.3 billion fellow people doing the best they can!  How dare the other PP deride as a “cult” a two-millennia old belief system the fundamental tenets of which are love and self-giving!  Neither PP would dare criticize other belief systems that treat child rape, particularly of girls, as normal. At least the Catholics admit it is a sin. Complain all you want about the management, but you have no right to attack the 1.3 billion regular believers who are as much victims as anyone else of these scandals. [/quote]

What’s a few million destroyed children because of all the other stuff we did and BTW this was covered up AT THE VERY TOP OF THE CHURCH! Pope after Pope allowed this! Your local priest knew this was a thing but shrugged his shoulders and arranged the pancake dinner. In any other org the “good” ones would have gathered and protested and called for a stop to it but they just let it go. Do all the mental gymnastics you want but it is wrong to support the Catholic Church in any way. It ‘ain’t the only church. [/quote]

And again, you fail or refuse to recognize the distinction between the body of believers, who have been harmed financially, morally and otherwise, and the perverts and bad managers who allowed the harm to occur. Your “knowledge” of ecclesiology is obviously pitiful, but not as pitiful as your understanding of Catholic theology. For Catholics, the Catholic Church in fact IS the “only church.”  Their belief system obliges them to accept a hierarchical structure, but it certainly does not render them responsible for the misdeeds of a few who manifestly acted in violation of Church moral teaching, and more than the Iraqis were responsible for Saddam, the Chinese people for Mao or the Cambodian people for Pol Pot.  The “VERY TOP OF THE CHURCH” is a rarified zone that is supposed to serve the believers; its sins are not theirs. You haven’t got the slightest idea what any priest knew or didn’t know about any case of alleged abuse. The ones I’ve known were as scandalized as any layman.[/quote]

You like the ritual? the turning of the wafer into the body and blood of Jesus? The wonderful feeling of belonging to the church that Jesus himself started (according to the legend).

Fine, stay on and hope your kid isn't next.[/quote]

First, it’s not a “wafer,” it is a “host,” or an “oblatum,” each referencing something destined for sacrifice.  Second, while liturgical ritual is important and a feeling of belonging to a community is helpful, neither is of the essence of being Catholic. Catholicism is a way of relating to and understanding God, insofar as Hod can be known and understood by mortal reason.  As for my own child, the likelihood of abuse is and always has been negligible. The vast majority of alleged victims claiming to have been exploited by mentally ill degenerates in the Church (or elsewhere) come from broken families, are seeking relationships they should be able to get elsewhere, and not infrequently mentally ill themselves. None of those things apply to me or my family. It is hugely uncharitable to wish evil on an innocent person because you disagree with their family’s religious values, beliefs and practices.  [/quote]

Are these “mentally ill” children from “broken families” not worthy of your care and protection? Do you not have an obligation as a Christian to protect, defend and nurture them? It seems your allegiance is to the human construct of the Church not the actual Church. [/quote]

If you bothered to read the post, you would see that the victimology discussion was in response to a stated hope that a poster’s child would be molested because another poster didn’t like something that was said. Everybody is entitled to proper treatment, but the fact is that many victims were abandoned by families and others long before they fell into the clutches of degenerates masquerading as churchmen. No one claims that anyone fell victim to bands of tonsured rapists, lurking and roaming at all hours, dragging victims off the street to debauch them. These crimes are not as simple as that. As for “human construct” versus “actual church,” there is no such distinction. The Church is a divine construct, but peopled by fallible humans, some of whom are terrible sinners and some of whom are saints.[/quote]

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