Reply to Should so called “thanksgiving” be a national day of mourning?

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Reply to "Should so called “thanksgiving” be a national day of mourning?"

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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]Do you know other cultures have Thanksgiving to celebrate the harvest? They didn’t all conquer North America. [/quote]

So maybe we shouldn’t have based this holiday on the myth about “pilgrims and Indians”.  [/quote]

Schools are dropping any mention of Indians at all. It's not just turkeys and Pilgrims. Sounds like that ought to make some people happy, everyone will just forget about them.[/quote]

Yup. They want to pretend like it never happened. Or the people aren’t still suffering today.

Revisionist history to the max. [/quote]

Not so much revisionist as irrelevant. People are moving forward, why should they dwell on the past when it has nothing to do with them? Obviously the people who were hurt feel differently, but they aren't making much of an impact convincing anyone else to put their needs first. Everyone has their own problems these days.[/quote]

Why do we bother to learn any history at all? It all happened in the past. Why dwell on any of it?  :lol:

Maybe if we don’t sugar coat history just to make white people feel comfortable then we can learn from our mistakes and do better in the future. 
[/quote]

Ha, as if white people are only bad.  So do the Plymouth protestors also cover the section in history where native Americans own African slaves? Yes, it really existed:

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smithsonian-institution/how-native-american-slaveholders-complicate-trail-tears-narrative-180968339/

Let's also not even get into the entire violent and oppressive histories all across Asia, the Arab slave trade, etc.  It's almost as if everyone's history is filled with oppression.

Go crawl under a rock and cry about it, because it will never end.[/quote]

Strawman. We are talking about *our* history and treatment of indigenous people.

Yes, enslaving people is bad. Also, mass murdering and oppressing indigenous people is wrong.

Why is it so difficult for some people to acknowledge that? 
[/quote]

Indigenous history is our history.  They owned slaves.  Why are we whitewashing native American history?  They were slave owners.[/quote]

Right. The Asian and Arab slave trade is not our history.  :roll:

As I already said, yes, enslaving people is bad. No one has claimed otherwise.

Also, mass murdering and oppressing indigenous people is wrong. Wouldn’t you agree? 
[/quote]

Sure oppressing people is wrong.  Germany is wrong for killing millions of Jews.  Japan is wrong for killing millions during WW2 too.  I don't think Germany and Japan need to be forced to 'mourn' or have a day of 'repenting' for what they did. History is history.[/quote]

Germany and Japan each paid massive reparations and we do have memorial days. ??

These are people living within our country. Our responsibility continues. Acknowledging their loss is the least we should do. 
[/quote]

We already have Indigenous Peoples' Day. And yet, that's not good enough even thought that's what you're asking for. So, what do you really want to happen?[/quote]

I’m not personally asking for anything.

On Thanksgiving, I do think we, the people in the US, should acknowledge the reality/perspective of the other people who were at this feast of our lore. If we are reflecting on all that we have, we can acknowledge there was also a massive human cost behind it.

Outside this holiday, we, the people of the US, should fix the wrongs that still persist today. 
[/quote]

Exactly how would you like people to acknowledge the human cost? Should Grandma say "I'm sorry for the Trail of Tears, but thankful for my health" every year? What does that accomplish exactly? Say whatever you like at your table but the performative aspect of what you are suggesting is ridiculous. And until you give up your home and property to fix the wrongs you're a hypocrite. We also means you.
[/quote]

We could acknowledge it in public schools. Include multiple perspectives of history.

In addition to pardoning turkeys, the POTUS could host a function for tribal leaders. Broadcast between football games.

If they are part of “the story”, include their voice. [/quote]

Yesterday the Mattaponi and Pamunkey tribes paid tribute to Governor Youngkin, as they have every year for 300 years.  That includes their voice in the story.

https://www.wric.com/news/local-news/richmond/governor-youngkin-hosts-mattaponi-pamunkey-tribes-for-annual-tax-tribute-ceremony/[/quote]

I wonder if they discussed his proposed changes to the VA history curriculum that called their ancestors “immigrants”. 
[/quote]

They are![/quote]

https://nativenewsonline.net/education/va-education-dept-backtracks-from-labeling-native-americans-as-america-s-first-immigrants

[i]“ Alton Carroll, a history professor at Northern Virginia Community College who is of Mescalero Apache descent, told Native News Online that his initial read of the proposed standards stood out to him for being “so glaringly wrong, and so heavily partisan.”

“[b]The idea that Native people were immigrants and therefore they have no more right to land than anybody else is a white supremacist talking point,[/b]” Caroll said. “And for that to be reproduced by a governor's office—it's appalling.”

Chief Frank Adams of the Upper Mattaponi Indian Tribe headquartered in King William County, Virginia, told Native News Online that the language used to describe Native people in what is now Virginia is harmful and inaccurate.

“I thought we were making progress and then you read something that’s so derogatory and so ugly and it’s like: how can educated people write these words on paper for the world to see? You can learn a lot of things, but it's really hard to unlearn them.”

Over the past year, a working group of diverse stakeholders has worked to craft new history and social science standards of learning, which Virginia updates every seven years. When the new standards were published late on a Friday evening, Nov. 11, members of the working group were stunned by last-minute changes to the proposed text.

Virginia Sen. Jennifer B. Boysko (D-Fairfax) said the new standards presented “drastic changes” from the ones she helped craft on behalf of Virginia’s Culturally Relevant and Inclusive Education Practices Advisory Committee that met from 2021 to 2022 to recommend new standards to the Department of Education.

“We had focused on making sure that we're telling the stories of all kinds of people who live in Virginia, from our indigenous population and our newer immigrants, people who have come within the 20th and 21st century,” Boysko told Native News Online. “[We were] focusing on being inclusive and looking at history without trying to pretend that it wasn't painful. And I believe that a lot of that has been whitewashed. “”[/i][/quote]

Assuming that everyone arrived in a single wave across the Bering Sea land bridge and that those people never fought over who owned area of land. [/quote]

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