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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]Another year with ND in the top 20. Another year the haters will say it won't last. Always get a chuckle out of this.[/quote]

Notre Dame is 3.59% black. Shameful[/quote]

A Catholic school in Indiana isn’t a huge draw for POC? Shocking!![/quote]

ahem. Using the same argument, there should be only 18% Catholics at ND because Indiana is only 18% Catholic.

No, when doing this analysis the experts compare to the national percentage of blacks, which is 14%. Hence, Harvard's black population is 14%.  So it is at the other top schools. How do they achieve this? By offering generous merit and financial aid packages. Clearly, ND isn't vested in increasing diversity for the sake of its own student body by trying to increase the number if black students, Catholic or not.[/quote]

4% of US Catholics are black. This lines up with the percent of blacks at Notre Dame.  Notre Dame is a religious school and has different institutional priorities than secular universities. [/quote]

Agree. ND is well known for its religious priorities and the students it attracts. Why anyone would expect different percentages of ND is ludicrous. Move on folks. [/quote]

+100

I am the one who posted that haters complain each year saying ND doesn't belong in T20. The fact of the matter is that ND will continue to focus it's priorities on its Catholic identity. This means there will be less appeal to the general non-Catholic public and limits its ability to attract people of more diversity. Despite ND's dedication to its strong Catholic identity, it manages to say on top of the rankings, likely because it makes up for this limitation with other very strong characteristics, like it's great academics, beautiful campus, strong athletics, and welcoming community. People here saying that other Catholic institutions manage to have more diversity, keep in mind that those schools are not as blatant about its religious affiliation. Specifically, ND has chapels in all of it's residence halls, a very active basilica on campus, Touchdown Jesus, the grotto, and many of the main student events have an element of religion sprinkled in. This might make some students uncomfortable -- hence the attraction is just not there. Still, it remains a T20 and that is what irks most people here on DCUM.[/quote]

No, we just find the diversity numbers to be disturbing. ND could do something about that if it chose to. It chooses not to divert funds to recruiting black students.[/quote]

Or if it wants to focus on Catholic students why doesn't it have more Latino students. It is weird to me that a school that emphasizes it's Catholic identity so much would have so few Latino students. Like ignore diversity for a second -- ND doesn't do a good job of merely representing the *Catholic* community. It's weird. [/quote]

Catholic Latina mom here. My high stats (fcps grad) kid did not even apply to ND. Our main reason was tuition. We probably would not have qualified for much aid either.

Second reason, although my kids went to k-8 parrochial school, many Latin American Catholics are not super conservative in the religious sense. Most are culturally Catholic, so ND being very focused on their religious identity, was not a draw for my DD.

Third reason:  Distance. Most college students in Latin America live at home and commute.  Living on campus is not the norm still for US Hispanics.  So when comparing percentages of Hispanic students in the US to those enrolled in universities, our numbers will always be lower at “isolated” campuses. In all fairness, my DD lives on campus at an in-state school.

Fourth:  North Bend is freaking cold for “my people”. I mean, the word “North” is in the name of the town!  Many kids are trying to attend schools in warmer regions anyway. [/quote]

Thanks for the insight. Seems spot on. But it’s “South Bend.”  Not that it makes it any warmer. [/quote]

Oops!  Thanks for the correction.

Also forgot to add…current low Hispanic numbers at ND will continue to make the school less attractive to future applicants. That good old self fulfilling prophecy.

I have never visited the campus, but from what I see in the football stands, the crowd does look very Caucasian, but let’s not forget, many Hispanics do look Caucasian. I’m thinking the few Hispanics that do apply, probably fit the Caucasian look. Those are the ones that are more likely able to afford the tuition. This due to the history of racism and colonialism in Latin America. [/quote]

Hey, now you are sounding bitter. Are you sure your kid didn't just get outright rejected?[/quote]

Not bitter at all. My kid did not apply to ND. We  fit the “white presenting” Hispanic stereotype, but I am also aware of the history of Latin America.

I  forgot to mention that most US Hispanics have mixed indigenous / African / European backgrounds, and probably have not seen many students at ND that look like them if they toured the campus. They would rather attend a school where they felt more students like them.

By the way, my DD is at UVA and enjoying  minute of it. [/quote]

Right, cause that's all you could afford.  Nothing wrong with that! My kid also got into UVA but chose ND. Money is no object for us.[/quote]

Thank you for response (?). I think my DD is doing just fine, being that my husband and I are both immigrants. UVA should provide our DD some upward mobility. And, yes, it is what we could afford without financial aid or loans. 
In my view, and in her’s, she is blessed to be attending UVA. [/quote]

She is. Her chances for social mobility are indeed greater. Talk about one i
of the greatest boosts in acsdemia and beyond: the Rhodes Scholarship. UVA has produced 56 Rhodes; Notre Dame only 9. [/quote]

[b][/b]A little history goes a long way.  Catholics (and Catholic colleges) received very few Rhodes Scholarships for the first 65 years or so of the award.  Cecil Rhodes Anglo-Saxon England was Protestant. [b] And while we are at it, NO awards went to women for the first 75 years.  So think of that when you are looking at schools like Wellesley.[/quote]

[b]If you are claiming[/b] that the Rhodes foundation discriminated against Catholics I would like to see proof. The experts at Time Magazine in 1956 say you are wrong. https://time.com/archive/6610699/education-how-to-be-a-rhodes-scholar/. Rhodes' religious preferences are unknown but all powerful British men in the 1860s were Protestant due to something called the Reformation. What does that mean? Nothing. Cull the literature on him. There is nothing about religion being important to him. We do know he was gay. Does that mean his foundation favored gay applicants? Of course not. He was a Mason. Does that mean scholarships went to Masons? Of course not. As the Time Magazine piece points out, the early Rhodes Scgokars came from America's earliest, most established and most elite schools, all of which were founded on some type of protestant religion to train clergy. Nothing more, nothing less.[/quote]

Why don't you just read the claim and don't add your words.  The facts stand.[/quote]

I did. You are wrong. I can explain why Catholics didn't get some of the earlier Thodes but you clearly don't want to listen to "a bit of history".[/quote]

OK, I am wrong.  Catholics received many of the earlier Rhodes scholarships.[/quote]

DP.  NO ONE cares about Rhodes scholarships in a discussion of college rankings.  Good grief.[/quote]

The subject came up after three boosters for Notre hijacked this thread. Then some mom brought up an irrelevance saying her kids didn't want to stay in VA. Then the thead became Notre Dame vs UVA. The true citation was given  that UVA has produced many more Rhodes Scholars than Notre Dame. Thar's how the subject was introduced [/quote]

There is a wacko UVA booster parent who can't stop himself from bragging (?) about Rhodes Scholars numbers - as if anyone, anywhere actually cares about that metric.  Don't take the bait the next time he starts up with his nonsense.[/quote]

UVa has produced more Rhodes Scholars than any other public university in the country.

Seems worthy of comment.[/quote]

It's not.  Also - West Point has produced twice as many.  They are also a public university.[/quote]

And the Naval Academy has produced roughly the same number of Rhodes Scolars as UVA. But not nearly as many as West Point. If people are using this as their metric, the military academies are clearly the best public universities in America. And it's not even close. The three academies with roughly 13,000 students combined has 4x the number of Rhodes Scholars compared to UVA, which has twice as many students.  [/quote]

Yep.  The UVA booster can't bear to admit this fact.  She always neglects to mention these facts.[/quote]

She or he us not neglecting anything. West Point is not open to the "public" because the public cannot wily-nily apply to it. There are congressional recommendations and many other hoops an applicant must jump through including mental and physical fitness (my ownnchild could not appy because he has ADHD).  It's a decision not taken lightly because of the military requirement of service. It attracts a very different type of student from across the nation. UVA is a state school. Very different institutions[/quote]

West Point is still a publicly-funded institution, which was the criteria in this ridiculous discussion.  And it still produces twice as many Rhodes Scholars as UVA.  Deal with it.[/quote]

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