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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]LOL. If you want to quantify please provide more detail around:

"You know how many times I've heard parents of Gen Ed kids share that their child is in 4th/5th grade and still can't memorize multiplication tables? Or they can't get them to read books?"

How many times was this? How many kids? Which school(s)? Since you are generalizing GE it'd be interesting to see how you came to [i]your[/i] conclusions. 
[/quote]

Precisely.  PP wants her anecdotes ("many times" is always a red flag for a BS-er) to reflect reality, but the anecdotes the rest of us must be fictional, according to her.  I'd love to hear [i]her[/i] exact statistics, with links.  [/quote]

[b]The only thing that my anecdotes support is that some kids struggle with the Gen Ed curriculum.  That's it.  Do you dispute that?
[/b]
I'm not trying to dismantle an entire program based on anecdotal evidence, contrary to the anti-AAP posters who, based on nothing, decide that ALL students should have the AAP curriculum, that all or most students have similar abilities - again, NO ONE has answered - how do you know? [/quote]

Regarding the bolded, I absolutely don't dispute that.  But then how can [i]you [/i]dispute that there are kids in GE who could easily do the AAP curriculum?  You can't.  Also, do you dispute that there are kids [b]within [/b]AAP who struggle with that curriculum, and who perhaps should not be there??

If AAP was an open, fluid program, kids would be able to cycle into and out of advanced classes, as needed.  No testing, appeals, etc. would be necessary; classroom performance would be the only criteria needed for the [i]teacher[/i] to determine who needed to move up, stay put, or move back down.  The whole process would be much cheaper, not to mention far less complicated.  But then it wouldn't be "special," and we all know how much you AAP parents love your special labels!

No one is trying to "dismantle" AAP, as much as you like to insist they are.  Instead, we're trying to make AAP available to anyone capable of doing the work - big difference.  And then maybe a [b]true[/b] gifted program could be put into place for those kids who, you know, [i]can't learn in regular classrooms[/i].  As the original mission of GT was supposed to be.   
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1) If there are kids in GE who could easily "do" the AAP curriculum, they were not able to demonstrate that in the screening file. If their parents feel like their child does need or could benefit from AAP, there is an opportunity to appeal EVERY year.  And its not just Gen Ed or AAP - there are services across the spectrum in between.  So if a child is in Gen Ed, but advanced in math, they get into the higher math groups, etc. Kids in Gen Ed are given oppporunties to be challenged as well, its not just a flat curriculum for all.

2) If there are kids in AAP who don't belong there, I'd sure hope their parents/teachers would collaborate to find the most appropriate place for them.  As I said before, FCPS errors on the side of inclusion, not exclusion - as I think should be the case.  No system is perfect, but I'd rather have one that mistakenly identifies kids, rather than one that misses more kids.

3) This is only anecdotal, but the AAP parents I know don't give a rat's ass about labels.

4) I cannot believe you think that having the [b]teacher[/b] as the SOLE criteria for identifying gifted kids.  This is so problematic, I'm not even sure where to begin.  Let's see...

Scenario A:  Shy, introverted, or maybe twice exceptional Susie doesn't impress the teacher, is never identified as gifted and never receives an appropriate curriculum.  Unless, of course, her parents recognize her giftedness and advocate for her and/or pay for expensive private testing.  But if Susie is poor....or her parents think she struggles in school because she's just not that bright....well, then Susie is screwed.  And so are the the hundreds of other Susie's who are never given a shot at being identified because there are no tests.

Scenario B:  Loudmouth, know it all Bobby is the teacher's pet and all the parents know that he's at the top of class because his mom is Room Mom.  If only there were some objective, more removed way to see which kids need a more rigorous curriculum.....hmmmmmmm.....

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