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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]I wish people were more honest about pelvic floor damage from birth. I don’t remember them mentioning it in any pre-birth classes. [/quote]

This is mostly due to the way women give birth (on their back with legs pushed back) and purple pushing. There is also no pelvic PT prior to birth that would alleviate some of the tightness and teach women how to properly engage the TVA to assist with childbirth. Pushing a poo out is not the same and to be frank, pushing a poo out is one of the worst things for your PF when pooping so when an 8lb baby is coming down vs a 1lb shit, the damage is greater than 8x the poo.

PF damage can happen from c-sections too because it can start just by being pregnant. A c-section does not absolve PF damage. We need better healthcare for WOMEN pre, post, and during childbirth.

I am distressed that women continue to think that vaginal vs section is the equalizer. Nope. [/quote]

You are wrong.

spontaneous vaginal delivery is significantly associated with stress incontinence and prolapse, and the most dramatic risk is associated with operative vaginal birth.

A scheduled (not emergency!) c section can be protective. No woman with a scheduled C section who did not go into labor will have levator ani avulsion.

[/quote]

Scheduled or not you can still have PF issues. So ONE issue can be saved by scheduled caections....cool and what about all the other risks and complications from c sections? And forceps delivery is most associated with the avulsion.

And I'd love to see the comparison of women with spontaneous vaginal birth who proceed pelvic PT on a regular basis during pregnancy and were appropriately taught to push and not rely on doctors who kept them on their backs purple pushing and then compared it to what we have now which is what I listed above ( back labor, purple pushing, no PT). 
 But wait that won't happen because apparently our only choices are to have a scheduled C-section and be cut open seven layers of tissue or deal with the difficulties of having an improperly managed vaginal birth.

Stellar![/quote]

You can get hit by a car on the sidewalk.  It's still safer than being in the middle of the road.

There are a lot of reasons to avoid a c-section, but it is absurd to suggest that the risk of pelvic floor injury is the same as with a vaginal birth.  It just isn't.  [/quote]

I worry that people will take the wrong message out of this thread and not understand that c sections are serious surgery and not an obvious answer. Agree with pp that something and men need better education prepping for birth.

Total anecdote but the friends I know who struggled the most with urinary incontience both had c sections. They feel super because they thought they would avoid all that sort of trouble.[/quote]

C sections are serious surgery. However, a lot of women will try for a natural birth and end up with one anyway. And that becomes an emergency C section which is far, far riskier than if mom had just had a scheduled C section. A lot of women will also have a vaginal birth that can leave them permanently altered in ways many are unaware - with continence issues of pee or stool or gas, scar tissue that hurts for years, prolapsing pelvic organs, difficulty passing stool due to a rectocele, vaginal laxity, levator avulsion, etc. These injuries can badly damage a woman’s self esteem, sex life, confidence, and ability to be active and exercise. Many of these women in older age or even younger age will then go on to have a serious surgery to repair these injuries - sling surgery, STARR procedure, hysterectomy, sacrocolpopexy, etc. this stuff is often just never spoken about until the injuries are sustained. And these surgeries are often not very successful, and they also carry quite a bit of risk.

Women deserve to be educated about risks of all modes of delivery and to make an informed choice about how they birth. For many women, especially older moms only planning one or two kids, a scheduled C section or two is a reasonable choice. No it will not mean you don’t have any issues.  For women who are younger, who don’t have risk factors, and who want lots of kids, trying for a vaginal birth is reasonable. There is no right answer for all of us. The price of birth can be high for birthing women. But personally, I would take my achy scar tissue and difficulty emptying fully from my c section over all my pelvic organs falling out my body through my vagina, which is what vaginal birth did to me. Everyone is different but it’s long past overdue that we talk about all these issues and make other younger women aware of the price they might pay to become a mother. [/quote]

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