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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]OP, consider reading a book called Parenting with Love and Logic.

A lot of it is about logical / natural consequences.

Are you willing to share what line he crossed, and what the punishment was?
[/quote]

He stole money from a sibling. Kid is old enough to know stealing is wrong, WTF. But it wasn't just the money -- we're talking about a small amount, but it was a gift from a special relative so it was like a keepsake that one of my other DCs wanted to keep as a souvenir, not as money. It can't be replaced. He had asked again and again if he could borrow, use and replace, the money and has been told no. We're talking a year and a half of asking and being told no. We're not talking about a lot of money either -- but the idea that he was told no for over a year, did it anyway knowing it would hurt his sibling's feelings (and mine) and could not be replaced with any other money, and then lied about having done it, then said his sibling deserved it, then said it was no big deal, "I already said I'm sorry," etc etc on and on and on and on -- I just lost it. This is how he operates, so it may not seem like a big deal, but it was the last straw for me. He had already lost screens for something else (and yes he has incentives -- he was told that screens were no longer considered a right, that if he wanted screens he had to earn them back, etc -- no impact). Plus he's been begging me for a phone, so I have been telling him for months that if he shows me he can be trusted he'll earn a phone, but he keeps saying he will and then doing dishonest shit like this.

I told him our phone deal was off. I was no longer going to be negotiating in good faith with someone who lies right to my face. I told him he was grounded for a month. I told him he would be replacing the money he took three-fold. I was super pissed (not talking to him in a soft voice, LOL). Nothing but self-pity and denial in response. Finally I said he sucked as a human being, that he wasn't doing any of the things he's been told to do to be a good person (or avoiding the things he's been told over and over to avoid to not be a bad person, like lying oamd stealing, again WTF) and that I was done. Just finished, and that if he was going to steal from family members, then he'd better watch his own back, too. Later he said he hadn't meant what he said, and I said "I did."

Not my finest moment as a mom, clearly. I admit that. I just lost it. I'm just completely and totally done operating in good faith with this kid and knowing he is going to punch me in the gut (emotionally) again and again and again.[/quote]

13:04 here. Okay, this sounds extreme. I stole and lied too, but when I got caught, I got defensive and yelled and insulted, but really did know that I messed up (even if I'd NEVER fess up). If you genuinely think that he is not recognizing what he's doing is wrong or feeling remorse (even if he doesn't show it), then definitely get an evaluation. The stealing money part made me think drugs (my sister stole CONSTANTLY when she started using drugs as a young teen, and later ended up with a serious problem that has messed up her life forever), but even if that's not it, he DEFINITELY needs someone to talk to and needs to learn some skills.

Don't give up on him. We're human, we lose our temper and yell. That's 100% okay IMO. But apologize, let him see how much he truly hurt you, let him see how scared you are. If you want to cry, then cry. Show him that his shitty behavior impacts you in ways other than anger. Anger he can handle and has figured out how to tune out, so it's totally useless. You've threatened him enough with being a bad person (which is legit!), that he's tuning that out too. If I were you, I'd tell him you are scared for his future and you need to start family counseling TOGETHER and he needs to get an evaluation. Because you're scared and you love him. If he's a normal stubborn kid, he'll understand that. If he can't understand that, then he definitely needs that evaluation and therapy.[/quote]

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