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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]There was a passage in the article talking about how gross out humor among boys -- poop jokes and such -- can evolve into saying crude things about women. That felt very familiar to me. I'm almost 50 years old now, so maybe things have changed. But when I was a teenager, maybe into my early twenties, I'd say the crudest stuff about women and others just to get a laugh from my friends. I absolutely didn't mean any of it -- it was just word games that got a laugh.

But now I can see how those jokes just feed into something worse. If nothing else, it would reinforce the worldview of those guys around me who truly believed that women were lesser than men. [/quote]

I'm 40 and had the same experience.  It was just talk, no one actually took a girl to bed and did the angry dragon or whatever nonsense we joked about.

But I found the most disapointing part of the article to be the absolute lack of desirable male traits such as protection, leadership and honor.  Those were things we all strongly believed in.

our society would be well-served by acknowledging the natural differences, on average, between boys and girls and harness boys natural competitiveness into something good rather than squash it and allow the worst instincts to take over[/quote]

I think I agree with the general thrust of your arguments. There are things to celebrate about being a man and boys should be given a positive vision to which to aspire. It shouldn't all be "don't, don't, don't." I'd be a little careful about the specifics though. I think women are just as capable of being protective, honorable leaders. I don't know how natural male competitiveness is or how distinctive it is from female competitiveness. Right now, I think boys youth culture is structured in such a way that ADHD little assholes have a leg up over the boys who have a little more self-discipline and mostly just want to laugh with their friends. We should respect the natural tendencies that are there but without making the mistake of confusing cultural structures for "nature." [/quote]

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