Reply to Here's how much legacy/athlete preferences matter at Harvard

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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]I don’t know that the math is that easy since the author doesn’t explain how the table is created - I don’t know how they get any of the numbers in the table so forgive if me I’m skeptical that your simple math is the right methodology.  I’d prefer to see the author of the table had reached the number, assuming they are intellectually honest.

But assuming you are correct that Asians see more of the gains when all preferences are removed, why aren’t Asians at a higher raw number than whites when legacy and athlete preferences only are removed?  It doesn’t make sense that the first group of admits are skewed towards whites but that the second group is skewed towards Asians.[/quote]

I'd like to answer your question but I'm not sure exactly what you mean.  There is no scenario where Asians become a higher raw number than whites due to the fact that so many more whites apply.

If legacy preference is removed: Whites -204, Asians +100, AA -56, Hispanics +63.  As I mentioned previously, some of this imbalance reflects the racial makeup of the last 50 years of Harvard alumni and will naturally correct itself over time.  I am certainly in favor of either removing legacy preference altogether (even though my kids would benefit from it) or imputing an equal advantage upon historically under-represented groups as a form of affirmative action.

[quote=Anonymous]I too am appalled at the culture of victimhood in this country, especially that perpetuated by middle class whites.[/quote]

I don't see it in middle class families where I live, but I do see it in poorer communities.  Both black and white.  It is not an ideology confined by race.  Where my family hails from in the rust belt, the traditional values of discipline and self-reliance are slowly being replaced by the same culture of victimhood that much of our african american inner city populations suffer from.  Both populations have been criminally neglected, although inner city african americans have suffered longer and more visibly than others.  I wish we had politicians who could inspire society to start to fix some of the real underlying systemic causes but unfortunately I see the opposite: politicians who want to amplify feelings of victimization.  I won't name names but they lead on both sides of the aisle.  What we are left with is the simple fact that if you want to improve your lot in life, the only person really interested in helping you is yourself.[/quote]

What I don't get is this:

Let's say that we did your math and removed both athletes and legacies.  The breakdown by your method, I believe, would be 4295 whites and 2669 Asians.  That's roughly 1.6 whites getting in for every Asian.  This is based solely on whatever standards are left, presumably 'merit'.

so why, when you remove race, does the ratio suddenly shift to .72 white students for every Asian?   It doesn't make sense that the ratios are so far off.  If anything, according to your logic, more whites applying should mean that more whites are admitted in both groups.  If more Asians are admitted in the second group because they are more qualified, then what explains the first group?  I'm not saying the ratios need to be the same, but does it make intuitive sense that they are so far off?

Imagine you were able to line up every applicant to Harvard from 1-40000 in order of merit (which is what people who want to blow the system up think will magically happen).  If that was the case, your analysis suggests that the front of the line be predominantly white but this one section of the line (spots 7000-8000) would be predominantly Asian. These are the students who are replacing the 'less qualified' AA and Hispanics who are now not getting in?  does that make ssense to you, especially when the raw numbers of Asian to white applicants is so low?
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