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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]People really took advantage of the DAS program. I don’t blame Disney for changing it.[/quote]

I do. People taking advantage of it is no reason to completely take away DAS from physically disabled people. It’s crazy to me that someone with like cerebral palsy or cancer or MS or whatever can’t use this service anymore because they don’t also have autism.[/quote]
It doesn't sound like the new policy removes all access to physical disabilities.  DAS is just excluding people whose issues can be solved with a pass to leave the line and return or a[b] mobility device (e.g., scooter or wheelchair) so they don't have to stand[/b].[/quote]

Part of the problem is forcing people to use mobility devices when they don't need them under normal circumstances. I've seen several stories about amputees who are perfectly "mobile" but who have difficulty waiting in long lines, especially in heat, as the day progresses because their prosthesis becomes less comfortable and more painful being denied DAS because they could just get a wheelchair. That seems wrong to me.

[/quote]

NP What?! Someone upthread told me that if my toddler can't wait in 30-60 minute lines I shouldn't go to Disney either.

They can get a scooter. There is nothing “wrong” about that. [/quote]

Huh. You don't think someone with a genuine physical disability that causes significant pain deserves some accommodation? By the way, ECVs cost $65 per day to rent, but I guess those slacker amputees should just deal.[/quote]

If they’re walking around a park all day on a prosthesis, there’s no reason they can’t stand in line with the same prosthesis. Or sit on the chair/cane. Or lean on the ropes like the rest of us. If they can’t walk around the park all day and can’t stand in line at all, they get a scooter or a wheelchair. 
Quit playing the victim here. There are options. You just don’t like them. [/quote]

NP. By that logic, people with zero physical disabilities who have autism can also just stand in line for hours. [/quote]

I don’t think that’s true. If an autistic kid can’t stand in line for an hour they may act out or scream or get physical or cause a disturbance to others waiting in line. It’s a completely different scenario. [/quote]

This. My kid has to eat in a lunch bunch because he cannot even handle the noise and commotion of the cafeteria at school. If he gets overstimulated/dysregulated he may throw himself on the ground and kick. That doesn’t happen often thankfully, but it does on occasion.

In order for our family to go to Disney, we had to pick a less crowded time, select a few must do rides, and basically have a straight forward itinerary to avoid crossing all over the park and having downtime built in. We bought Genie + in conjunction to using DAS and were able to minimize crowd/line time, take meal breaks while waiting for our return time, and get in and out of the park in a shorter time.

I know people pay a lot of money to go to Disney and I appreciate not having to risk a) my kid losing it 80 minutes into a 90 minute wait and then having to give up on the ride and b) disturbing other guests if my kid flails and is upset.[/quote]
Why are you taking a kid who can't cope in crowded places to Disney?  Goodness.  Choose a different vacation.[/quote]

What’s wrong with you? Disney makes an effort to be inclusive. Kids with disabilities deserve to experience the magic of seeing their favorite characters come to life. My son also needed to eat in a lunch bunch during camp, where he gets dysregulated, but loves Disney world. He was obsessed with Toy Story the first time we went, and the castle. He was mesmerized by the fireworks. And all the entertainment was great for his adhd needs - we just have to know when to take breaks from all the stimulation, which we can do in our small family setting. We modify our vacation to meet his needs, but I can’t imagine having him miss out on Disney altogether. I’ve seen autistic people waiting in lines for cosmic rewind, wearing sensory friendly headphones. This is such a spectacularly out of touch comment. [/quote]

NP What?! Someone upthread told me that if my toddler can't wait in 30-60 minute lines I shouldn't go to Disney either. Don't all kids deserve the magic of Disney? Their lines are untenable for all. 
[/quote]

Yes, if you don’t want to wait in long lines you pay for genie+. The same way you pay for premium economy on an airplane. It’s a different than children with disabilities.[/quote]

We did pay for genie+... the lightning lanes are still 20-30 min long and then you have to wait in other long lines between your genie + rides.[/quote]

And if your toddler cannot handle that then they cannot handle Disney. [/quote]

Not really, you can call that ADHD, autism, or anxiety and boom, get a DAS pass. It's apparently very easy. What you can't do is rent a scooter anymore and have it be a disability that qualifies. You don't need a doctor's note or diagnosis to qualify you just have to register for the process and have a video chat. [/quote]

Also, this is lying. I would never lie about my child’s condition. I am completely honest with Disney about his conditions and behaviors, and they can tell me if that qualifies or not. Shame on people who lie. [/quote]

And one more point- I wish my son didn’t have the difficulties that make him eligible for a DAS pass. One accommodation on a five day trip to Disney world does not make up for how much harder he needs to work on a daily basis to function in his everyday life. It does not compensate for the impact it has on our family and other child. I wish people understood this and had empathy for families of children with special needs. [/quote]

This! People are upset over a child with disabilities getting a perceived “perk” over their family. But I’m willing to bet they wouldn’t trade places if they realized the trade offs this accommodation comes with. Want to drop 5k on a neuropsych, out of pocket therapies, calls from the school, IEP meetings, etc. Like my goodness, let the families of special needs kids have something to help them so they can take their neurodiverse child (and siblings growing up with a special needs family member) on a somewhat normal vacation.

What is next, is the PP going to be upset that amputees get to park closer to the store? That is an unfair advantage while others have to walk farther back in the lot. I mean maybe my feet are hurting too that day, so why should the person with a prosthetic get special treatment. Perhaps they should just stay home and order online groceries instead.

(Obviously this last paragraph is sarcasm).[/quote]

Umm no one is complaining over people with REAL disabilities getting DAS. There were whole websites that told you how to fake DAS. Lots of blog posts and facebook groups too. [/quote]

No there was absolutely a poster I was referring to (hopefully only one, but maybe more) saying kids with developmental disabilities shouldn’t be going on Disney vacations and that every kid under 10 could benefit from not waiting in line so why should these kids get a benefit.

As a person who a kid who has SNs and cannot cram in a gazillion rides from sun up to sun down, I’d be fine with a cap or limits on popular rides. I’m just disgusted by certain people saying disabled kids should basically not go at all.[/quote]
Your reading comprehension is terrible.  The statement was that Disney isn't a good vacation choice for a kid who is made upset by noise, crowds and stimulation.  DAS doesn't remove those aspects.  Disney is still noisy, crowded and over stimulating.[/quote]

And DAS provides accommodations to help those kid still get to enjoy the magic of a Disney vacation. My son can get dysregulated in certain situations, so we don’t push him to the brink. We make a reasonable ride schedule (he does love the rides). He loves interacting with the characters. We book meal reservations in advance (buffets are great b/c there is no wait and lots of food options for picky eaters). There are multiple pools at many resorts so you can pick a quieter pool to go back and relax at. We also stay on property so we’re close by if we want to take breaks back at your room.

So who are you to say kids like mine can’t have a good vacation at Disney? DAS along with other planning measures on our family’s part allow him to enjoy a family vacation, better in some ways than traveling to places are that less self contained and curated for families.

I am sure there is abuse. I’ll trust Disney’s statistics on it and am fine with a paperwork process since we can easily provide that. But to say DAS doesn’t help with developmental disabilities and that it’s not a good vacation for them is just ignorant of how amazing Disney really is for families including kids with SNs.[/quote]
You are making a lot of assumptions and drawing conclusions that I never said.  Go ahead and keep debating with yourself, because I didn't say those things.[/quote]

NP here. You actually did say these things, so the pp's conclusions are logical. [/quote]
Nope.  I didn't.  The PP is arguing with herself.[/quote]

They're not. They are disagreeing with an ableist.[/quote] Nevermind the post up thread where I shared my own terrible experience at Disney with my daughter who kept melting down and my view that DAS wouldn't have fixed it.  I really hate the idea that families are dragging their neurodivergent kid all across Disney to use them for a DAS pass when the whole thing is nothing but stress to the kid.  Then parents pat themselves on the back that they avoided a total meltdown but got to ride a ton of rides with DAS.  (Not that different than dragging 90 yo grandma around the park.)

My daughter has had fabulous experiences at lower stress parks like Dutch Wonderland where she got to ride tons of rides with no lines, no crowds and no waits.  She loved meeting characters at Great Wolf Lodge.  Disney is a cluster these days and I really question if going there is even worth it for anyone.  It's just so crowded and stressful.

I don't know your kid and if your kid can enjoy Disney with DAS, but I do not think it's an appropriate trip for all kids.  It's a stressful place and not at easy vacation at all, and that's even harder for a kid who doesn't do well with crowds, noise, or stimulation.  As I experienced with my daughter, her rigidity was also a huge problem when rides closed unexpectedly, we had to wait for buses and then they were packed, or there was a thunderstorm that closed rides and pools.  Really, it was awful for her so I don't put a lot into all these rosy stories of neurodiverse kids having a blast.  [/quote]
.[/quote]

Hi ableist! Kids (and adults) with [b]special needs can love all things Disney, [/b]also! It's not just for NT people.[/quote]
Please let me know where I said something to the contrary.  Oh wait.  I didn't.  Stop putting words in my mouth.  [/quote]

It's the words YOU posted. YOU.[/quote]
If it was my words, you'd quote them.  But I never did, so you can't.  All caps doesn't help your case.[/quote]

There is no 'case'. YOU have been posting ableist, imagined rants throughout this thread. At least, I hope it is just one person doing it. If it's more than one, that's even more pathetic. But I'll quote a few.

[b]I'll just add that I'm sceptical that Disney only offers DAS to convince parents of neurodiverse kids that Disney is still an appropriate vacation for their kid (despite crowds and lines and everything else) so those families don't go spend their money elsewhere.  It's really just a marketing tool[/b]

[b]Really, it was awful for her so I don't put a lot into all these rosy stories of neurodiverse kids having a blast.[/b]

[b]Why are you taking a kid who can't cope in crowded places to Disney?  Goodness.  Choose a different vacation.[/b]

[b]If they’re walking around a park all day on a prosthesis, there’s no reason they can’t stand in line with the same prosthesis.[/b]

[/quote]
The prothesis one wasn't me.

I stand by my statement that Disney isn't a good choice of vacations for all neurodiverse kids, whether or not DAS is available.  It's insanely crowded and not a good choice for kids who melt down in crowds.  It requires an amount of flexibility that may rigid kids don't have.  It entails a level of stimulation that many kids can't handle.  I also said, which you chose not to quote, that I don't know your kid or whether they actually enjoy Disney.  But Disney made my kid absolutely miserable and I stand by that.  Not all kids should vacation at Disney.

I never said that "special needs kids can't enjoy Disney", which is what you accused me of saying.  I said it's not an appropriate choice for some kids and gave a list of reasons why.   [/quote]

And you just demonstrated your ableism![/quote]
Ok, so you have every right to take your kid on vacations that make them miserable. That's your right.  Have a great time.

Disney isn't going to make their parks less stimulating, reduce crowds, reduce noice, or prevent situations like ride closures that require flexibility.  It's not possible.  I choose to take my family on vacations where we all can have a fabulous time, not just those who aren't neurodiverse.[/quote]

I'm a DP who doesn't have a child with a developmental disability, so I have no personal stake in this debate. You aren't considering the fact that families often include neurotypical siblings who are able to enjoy Disney without a struggle and whose lives constantly be impacted by managing their siblings' disability (if it is serious enough). Is it really so horrible to give a family that manages a child's disability the opportunity to make it more likely the then entire family can have a good vacation?[/quote]
I've never suggested that Disney stop offering DAS passes.  I'm just acknowledging that a DAS pass isn't a fix for all kids.  [b]It's not a panacea[/b].

As a parent it's not a vacation to keep constantly maneuvering to try to avoid meltdowns all while holding your breath that your kid is about to explode at any moment. DAS doesn't fix that either.

My whole family was miserable when Disney didn't work for one child in my family and that made us all miserable.  There was no magic for us.  [/quote]

Who said it was? Obviously it’s one factor to help a family with a neurodiverse kid enjoy Disney. It won’t work for all kids. But it does help a good number of kids including mine.

I don’t understand why you keep making comments like:

“I  really hate the idea that families are dragging their neurodivergent kid all across Disney to use them for a DAS pass when the whole thing is nothing but stress to the kid.” and

“you have every right to take your kid on vacations that make them miserable.”

And when people say their kid was able to have a good time, you call it “rosie stories” as if we’re all misrepresenting our children.

You absolutely could have made your point that even with the DAS Disney will not be accessible to every neurodivergent child without throwing in all the jabs at parents of SNs kids who had a different experience from you. Autism is a spectrum after all, which you should know. You mentioned GWL worked for your child, which is great, but other SNs kids may not do well in a giant enclosed water park with kids running and splashing around. You can have different experiences without invalidating other parents. [/quote]

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