Reply to NOVA Stats for spring '17 UVA, W & M & Tech acceptances (or not)

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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote] First, in any AP school you are not seeing more than 20 percent of the students pushing for a full range of AP courses across the subjects[/quote]

That may be true, but we certainly don't see 20% of students in IB schools getting the IB diploma--at least not in the vast majority of them.[/quote]

I am going to repeat myself since you don't want to hear this. In the three schools where it's thriving, roughly 20 percent of the students complete the IB diploma.

Also, looking at the chart the other poster provided, all you can take away is that in AP schools, a large portion of the students complete a minimum of three AP courses with a score of 3 or better. That still doesn't contradict the point that AP's strength is that it's an a-la cart program and students can tailor their coursework to their strengths and that AP schools often have the issue that there's no defined "most rigorous," which creates this arms race where students are loading up on APs as early as 9th grade.[/quote].

20% does not seem to be indicative of a "thriving" IB diploma program, especially in comparison to the numerous AP schools where higher numbers of students are succeeding in AP courses and receiving recognition.

As for whether the less prescriptive nature of AP creates an "arm's race" among students, one could just as easily describe IB as a "one-size-fits-all" program with multiple hoops for IB students to jump through to placate the educational bureaucrats at the IBO in Geneva.

Finally, I think you mean "a la carte," not "a-la-cart." [/quote]

You are completely wrong. Beyond TJ, there is no school in the county where you will find more than 20 percent of students completing a full cohort of AP courses across the disciplines. It just doesn't happen.

What you will see -- and what you keep ignoring -- is that a large cohort of kids will choose courses that focus on their strengths. Then again, this happens in IB schools as well. Over 80 percent of students complete an IB course.

An IB diploma program where 20 percent of the students are successful is actually amazing because it's a rigorous program. It's not meant for a general education -- it's an advanced program of study like AP classes.

I am going to ignore the snark since you feel compelled to be rude, but I am going to reiterate, IB is a great program and at the schools where it's doing well, these students are getting an extraordinary opportunity to learn. I'm not saying one is better, but it's also not a dumpster fire at Marshall or Robinson.

And looking at other places, you can see its appeal. Falls Church City, WL in Arlington, the MCPS IB magnet schools. People are clamoring to get into these IB programs.

What you don't like is the strategic thing FCPS did when it put IB in high poverty schools. I get that. But it doesn't undermine the point that the IB program is a fantastic opportunity for some kids if they can get into a successful IB school like Marshall or Robinson or South Lakes.[/quote]

Sorry, but you're missing the salient points.

Others have already pointed out that the IB diploma program is not equivalent to what you'd call a "full cohort of AP courses," because the IB program includes SL courses that are not as rigorous as AP.

Calling IB a success because students take a single IB course in four years of high school is preposterous, when the express goal of the IB diploma program, at least initially, was for all students at "IBO World Schools" to pursue an IB diploma.  The IBO may have dialed that back, in an effort to preserve its educational market share, but every IB high school still revolves around the IBO diploma program, with non-diploma students made to feel second-class.  You should, but refuse, to ask whether the students who take a few IB courses would have been better served if other courses were available instead of being presented with IB options.

People are clamoring to get into the IB magnet program in MCPS because it is a magnet.  People only "clamor" to get into George Mason or W-L because of their locations and/or demographics.

You keep trying to minimize the problems with IB in FCPS by declaring it an amazing success at the three schools (out of eight) where there is marginally greater participation in the IB diploma program.  As others have noted, however, the "fantastic opportunity" that IB provides for a small fraction of the students comes at the expense of other students, who both fail to obtain IB diplomas and have limited access to the more flexible AP curriculum (or additional vocational courses that might be offered if we weren't overpaying for IB coordinators at everty school and incurring IB training costs).  That would be the case even if FCPS had been able to convince one of the highest-achieving schools in the county to adopt IB (which it has not been able to do), but it is particularly unfortunate when IB is forced upon high-poverty schools in an unsuccessful attempt to retain higher-achieving kids.

We should have IB magnet programs in, at most, two schools in the county.     [/quote]

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