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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]
np. I have a feeling you spend a lot more time either "choosing your battles," as the euphemism goes, and/or managing an endless matrix of arbitrary incentives and penalties. And you or your friends probably still complain that the kids "just don't listen."[/quote]
+1  Different parents seem to have different definitions of "well behaved" child.

I saw a mom do nothing as her child took something from another child who was playing with it.  The child asked for it back, and the mom just looked at that kid and shrugged her shoulders.   She probably thinks her child is well behaved because he at least didn't hit that child or throw a tantrum.

And you read the posts about how some parents will go over the Principal to get their precious snowflakes out of trouble, and I bet these parents still think their children are well behaved because... you know, they get good grades and everything.[/quote]

"civil discussion" poster here - this isn't a problem with a lack of spanking though, it's parents without any boundaries. My parents spanked when we were growing up but also didn't intervene in things like this. I do choose my battles, which means that I don't force my child to wear the pink shirt if she preferred the black one or whatever - if my kids were not hurting, upsetting, or annoying someone else I tried to be pretty lenient - choosing to enforce only the bigger issues so i wasn't always the party of "no." However, I fully admit that lacking a "fear factor" means you basically cannot force your kids to do things they don't want to do without a battle. I guess it wasn't worth it or a priority to me to "force" my kids to do something. That meant getting compliance was a little bit different for me than for a spanker but by no means did I just sit there and let my kid hurt others. I think you're confusing no discipline with no spanking and again as i started this comment with, many spankers are also very sporadic with discipline overall... [/quote]

Oops - me again and that went off before finished. I only meant to clarify, that I DO take action when my child hurts another child or upsets another child and taking a toy from someone will get an enforcement from me every time. Since this is usually an issue with younger children, who don't know better, I think it's absolutely appropriate to take the toy back off the "taking" child and say "Sarah was playing with giraffe. Your turn if she gets finished" or some variation. If an older child takes the toy and knows better, then I would return the toy and take my child aside and require a break from play. It's not really even intended as punishment, but to get my kid away from the kid who he / she is harassing for the benefit of that child's peace. If my kid persists in the bad behavior, we leave. So I actually do enforce things like this and it has nothing to do with spanking or not. And btw, it's not like that's a spanking offense anyway, right? But i get you were making a point. And actually agree with you - lots of parents, both those who spank and those who don't, just sit there while their kids are unkind to others - really uncool! [/quote]
NP.

I'm a non-spanker. I recently had a conversation with a spanner, who was talking about how ill-behaved her suster's children were, and assumed it was because they didn't get spanked. One example was her nephew ramming a comb through a screen door, breaking it. "I would've given him a spanking and he would have learned his lesson. She just sat there and thought it was funny."

I told her essentially that this seemed like a case of no boundaries and lazy parenting, [i]not[/i] proof that spanking would have been the only solution to the problem. And she was astonished. "What would you have done, just like taken him away?" Sure, for starters. But there would have been a consequence associated with the behavior, too. I certainly wouldn't have just laughed while my kid destroyed someone's property. [/quote]

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