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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]I have no trouble believing Trump was legitimately elected.

But no, I'm not going to "come together" with people who think that I don't deserve to make healthcare decisions about my own body or think that their right to own an AR 15 is more important than my and my children's right to not get randomly shot in public.

I'm sorry, I just can't "come together" with people who believe those things. [/quote]

What's the alternative? Fight them? Despise them? Deplore them?

How will any of those options improve things?

My suggestion: talk to them, listen to them, and find areas where you do agree. Find common ground where it exists and gain mutual understanding where it doesn't.

THAT is the path forward to a better nation.

--Harris voter who has lived in the bluest and reddest parts of America (happily)[/quote]

Hard Pass. I don't need a$$holes as friends. Coming around to their way of thinking (what you think I should do) is not going to "improve" things either. [/quote]

You missed the point entirely.

1. I’m not talking about being “friends”. I’m talking about interacting.

2. I’m not talking about “coming around to their way of thinking”. I’m talking about understanding their way of thinking and explaining yours.

You want to make things better and/or get your way politically?

You’d better find allies, forge consensus, and compromise.
[/quote]

MAGA abhor compromise.  Where was the compromise when Biden won?  Didn't see any?  No?  That's right, you didn't.  You saw an insurrection and constant vitriol and obstruction.

*You* voted for this acrimony.  Live with it.[/quote]

*I* voted for Harris. And Obama. And Clinton. And Biden.

*I* don’t live in a blue bubble.

*I* DGAF about who started it or who’s more awful or who hurt whose feelings.

*I* DO want to win and I never want to see a national MAGA candidate elected again.

*You’d* apparently rather be outraged than sully yourself by actually doing the work to understand and persuade people.[/quote]

Persuade them with what?  Please do tell us how we can get through to the MAGA faithful when they are so deeply, deeply invested in Trump's hateful lies?  Please share this amazing wisdom you have that no one has figured out before now.  HOW WILL YOU GET THEM OUT OF THEIR BUBBLE?  I ask you seriously.  Lay it out.

Sully myself? I'm in a bubble?  Why?  Because I read multiple news sources and think critically about the world? 
 Because I judge people by their words and actions?  I would sully myself if I capitulate to those hateful lies.  I will not go along with their hateful nonsense.

You act as though these MAGA people will come to the table to discuss things in good faith.  I think you are a fool.  Won't ever happen.[/quote]

“Persuade them with what?”

That question literally says it all. You don’t know enough about these people to even know who they are or what they care about.

Start there.

And yes, you should literally sit down at the table with some Trump voters. I think you’ll be surprised at how uninvested most of them are in his most hateful and egregious positions.

This isn’t about “capitulating”. Quite the opposite: it’s about winning.

Perhaps you should apply your undoubtedly elite critical thinking skills to that goal. Seems more productive than performative outrage.

—Harris voter who also voraciously consumes media, thinks critically, has multiple advanced degrees from “elite” institutions

[/quote]

For someone who claims to be about listening and understanding and moving forward, you are unrelentingly condescending and rude. I'm sure the MAGA voters will just love having you talk down to them. You didn't answer my question, because of your *inaccurate*, knee jerk reaction to "Persuade them with what?" There is an elitist in this conversation and it's not me.

I have listened to them.  Over and over again for eight years.  "Persuade them with what" refers to the fact that, though they say they care about immigration and the economy first and foremost, they have shown with their votes that they aren't really interested in any factually-based discussion or feasible answers on how to deal with those things.  How do you bring these people back to the table to discuss real solutions when they won't even agree on the facts of what is happening?  When they prefer the lies and scapegoating of Trump?  Are you suggesting we listen again to these complaints we have all HEARD A MILLION TIMES and then lie to them in the same way Trump does?  That immigrants are all rapists and murders who are stealing their jobs?  That mass deportation of immigrants will solve all their problems?  That tariffs are the way to address inflation?  He said those things and they voted "yes".

After you listen to all these grievances that we are all really, really, really familiar with by now (if you actually do consume news from multiple sources), what will you say?  How will you counteract the misinformation?  How will you "win"?  Are you going to pat them on the hand and tell them about your degrees from "elite" institutions?

[/quote]

You get it now?

I actually just mimicked your approach by pointing out my information level and ability to process complex information.

Your reaction? You found me condescending and rude.

That was precisely the point. That’s exactly how educated elites in the bubble come across.

As for your substantive points, you can’t read about people, you need to know them and vice versa.

I had lunch with a Trump voter last week. Didn’t change his vote for President, but did persuade him to vote for the abortion referendum on the ballot in his state.

How? By presenting him with facts about the effect of the referendum and talking about my daughters and what it means to them.

Information, persuasion, respect, relationships, and willingness to listen with an open mind work on an individual level.

On a macro level, you’re right about the issues they care most about: inflation and the economy.

Dems should have hammered the (inflationary) tariff proposal. And Trump’s work in killing the immigration bill.

But were these the main points of emphasis? No. What did we hear instead? Fascism, dog eating, garbage, etc., with a dose of “the economy is great” to boot.

Reflects a party-wide inability to communicate with people.

The disconnect is startling.

Your turn. Since you clearly view these people as irredeemable idiots, how exactly do YOU propose to win a national election?
[/quote]

NP.  If you can't dazzle with brilliance then baffle with bull $&it!  I had to put high top boots on to read your screed above.[/quote]

I was going for brilliance with a gloss of BS for entertainment value.

I feel like I succeeded admirably, if not briefly.

FWIW, the anecdote is in fact true. [/quote]

So you admit you are full of BS?  You sure are.[/quote]

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