Reply to Homeless Man Killed by Fellow Passenger on NYC Subway

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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]This guy is getting charged, I guarantee it. No reason to put someone in a chokehold for 15 minutes, especially with other men helping to contain the mentally ill man.

It was disproportionate use of force relative to the risk. No gun or knife was drawn. [/quote]
The fact that there is such a debate over the Marine’s actions demonstrates why he won’t be indicted. You will not be able to get a group of people to unanimously agree to indict or convict him. At some point there will be complete video of the homeless guy’s behavior that comes out and it will show him acting aggressive and threatening and not merely saying he was hungry and thirsty and that will be it. [/quote]

You don't need a unanimous vote to indict, just 12 of 23 in New York. [/quote]

Also, unlike the ignoramuses on this thread, the jurors will understand the law once it’s explained and they will realize you can just kill someone’s for yelling they are hungry and thirsty.[/quote]

In an interview, speaking in Spanish, the same witness also noted that the victim said that he didn't care if he got a big life sentence. He also described his fear and concern that the victim might be armed. Police investigators also stated that witnesses told them the man

According to the news, he was doing more than that.

But go ahead and minimize the danger of people - violence on the subway only happens to someone else in your world.[/quote]

According to eyewitnesses he was not.[/quote]

Here is what the eyewitness who took the video said per the New York Post:

[quote]The 24-year-old passenger stepped in after the vagrant, identified by sources as Jordan Neely, 30, began going [b]on an aggressive rant [/b]on a northbound F train Monday afternoon, according to police and a witness who took the video.

“He starts to make a speech,” freelance journalist Juan Alberto Vazquez said in Spanish during an interview Tuesday, referring to the disturbed man.

“He started screaming in an aggressive manner,” Vazquez told The Post. “He said he had no food, he had no drink, that he was tired[b] and doesn’t care if he goes to jail[/b]. He started screaming all these things, took off his jacket, a black jacket that he had, and threw it on the ground.”

That’s when he said the straphanger came up behind Neely and took him to the ground in a chokehold — keeping him there for some 15 minutes, Vazquez said.

The approximately three-minute-and-a-half-long video shot by Vazquez shows the blond subway rider lying on the floor of the train with his arm wrapped around the man’s neck.

The 24-year-old passenger stepped in after the vagrant, identified by sources as Jordan Neely, 30, began going on an aggressive rant.

Neely — who was living on the streets and had a history of mental health issues — lost consciousness after being put in the chokehold, and EMS workers at the station were unable to revive him, police and law enforcement sources said.

The straphanger — who sources said is a Marine veteran — was taken into custody and later released without charges.

The investigation is ongoing and authorities were waiting on autopsy results before deciding whether to pursue charges against the younger man, sources said.

He declined to comment when reached by The Post Tuesday, saying, “I am not interested in answering any questions, thank you.”

Vazquez, who was on his way to Yonkers at about 2:30 p.m. on Monday, said Neely barged into the train at the Second Avenue station — [b]and quickly began screaming and yelling at riders, prompting many to move away.[/b]

Video taken later shows the man flailing his arms and legs in an effort to free himself as the straphanger has him in a headlock and another bystander helps to hold him down on the floor of the subway train.

“He moved his arms but he couldn’t express anything,” Vazquez said of Neely. “All he could do was move his arms.

“Then suddenly he just stopped moving,” Vasquez recalled. “He was out of strength.”

The stranger came up behind Neely and took him to the ground in a chokehold for 15 minutes.
A person can be heard in the video expressing worry about Neely’s well-being off-camera.

The man who had been helping the straphanger hold Neely down replies that “He’s not squeezing no more.” The two then let Neely go after a few seconds, leaving him lying on his side on the ground.

“None of us who were there thought he was in danger of dying,” Vasquez said. “We thought he just passed out or ran out of air.”

Neely lost consciousness after being put in the chokehold, and EMS workers at the station were unable to revive him.

Vazquez said he had mixed feelings about the fatal encounter — particularly since he said Neely had not physically attacked anyone on the train before he was taken down.

“I think that in one sense it’s fine that citizens want to jump in and help. But I think as heroes we have to use moderation,” he said.

[b]“This would never have happened if the police had shown up within five minutes,” he added. “Then we’d be talking about a true hero. It’s complicated.”[/b][/quote]

The same witness described how he was in fear and was worried that the victim might have a weapon. Police also reported that witnesses recall the man saying, "I'm not taking no for an answer" and "I'll hurt anyone on this train." He clearly viewed the intervention as a heroic measure but not the tragic outcome.
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