Reply to Is FCPS ending advance math for students who are not in AAP?

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Reply to "Is FCPS ending advance math for students who are not in AAP?"

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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]It was the year 2000.  But that just proves my point.  Many ideas and reforms aren't novel new ideas, they are updates/reboots/refined versions of older ideas.  So flexible groupings were the status quo in the 80's to 90's, the pendulum moved away from that.  We then saw things like balanced literacy and "new" math.  Things seem to move further left with the equity focus, etc.  Are we starting to go back towards the center?[/quote]

So last century.

Flexible groupings are far more equitable than AAP. 
[/quote]

PP.  Yes, I agree with you.  It worked when I was a kid, things started to change when I was in college and hopefully things will swing back that direction.  I like the very small GT for those who really need it.[/quote]

DP.  Agreed.  I'm the poster who grew up in FCPS when there was a tiny GT program.  No one resented those students because it was clear they were ACTUALLY gifted and needed a separate program.  Everyone else was put into flexible groups depending on their level, and no one was locked into any one group.  Students can improve and move up, or receive remediation, depending on their abilities in each core subject.  That was the way to go.  [/quote]

I was also in that tiny GT program and I teach for FCPS right now. The dynamics of the current classroom wouldn’t support that type of program anymore. There are kids, in one classroom, at seven different math and reading levels. To be able to put students in the groups that they “should” be in is essentially illegal nowadays.[/quote]

Have you read the entire thread?  This isn't at all what is being discussed here.  It's been repeated, over and over, that what FCPS needs are flexible groupings [b]*among the entire grade level team*[/b].  So Teacher A would take all the advanced math kids, Teacher B would take the grade-level kids, Teacher C would take the remedial group.  And so on for [b]all four core subjects[/b].  No one is talking about dividing up each individual classroom into multiple levels.

And if flexible grouping is "essentially illegal" nowadays (??), then assigning 7 yr. olds to either AAP or GE should absolutely be illegal.[/quote]

This is clearly written by someone who knows nothing about teaching/education. Why don’t you go to the national Department of Education website and do a little research on ability tracking. Once you’ve read up on that, then you’ll realize why FCPS specifically pushes more minorities into AAP. [/quote]

Doesn't work though[/quote]

I am new to the forum. Why does FCPS specifically push more minorities into AAP? Thanks.[/quote]

FCPS is an academic system; ie - a school system.

[b]FCPS has repeatedly stressed academics are not their first priority.  [/b]

Equity is the FCPS school board and superintendent’s first priority.  They stress this over and over.[/quote]

Citation? [/quote]

https://wpde.com/amp/news/nation-world/marginalization-is-driving-force-for-resource-allocation-in-virginia-school-district-fairfax-county-public-schools-equity-policy-thomas-jefferson-high-school-national-merit-recognition

Google the rest yourself.[/quote]
They are pushing for MORE kids to finish Alg 1 by 8th. They are promoting acceleration. 
[/quote]
And also removing acceleration for others aiming for Algebra in 7th. Equity. [/quote]

California attempted a [b]similar approach [/b]to “equity math.”  It was a monumental disaster, both in failing to achieve equity but also in failing to educate the most capable students:

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/10/california-math-framework-algebra/675509/

Fairfax county’s school board and the superintendent are leading FCPS down a path to disaster.[/quote]

They were also pushing more kids to take Alg 1 in 8th? [/quote]
DP Heterogenous classes[/quote]

How is that relevant to what FCPS is doing? FCPS is pushing to have MORE kids take Alg 1 in 8th, not eliminating it. [/quote]
With E3, FCPS is making Grade 3 and Grade 4 math classes heterogenous; they are no longer offering separate advanced and regular math classes. CA also emphasized heterogenous classes. When you put a wide range of kids in one class, it makes it hard for teachers. They are not going to be able to successfully differentiate for everyone's needs, meaning they'll target instruction to the middle, shortchanging kids at either end. When they tried this in San Francisco, it widened the achievement gap, with kids at the lowest end of the spectrum hit the hardest. That is why some posters are questioning whether kids will be prepared for 8th grade Algebra in practice, if the method used to get there is E3's heterogenous math class approach. [/quote]

They did many other changes in SF. Not comparable. [/quote]
But heterogenous classes were one of biggest changes in San Francisco. And now FCPS is beginning down that path as well.[/quote]

Big scary heterogenous classes in early elementary! How will you sleep at night? [/quote]
Presently, FCPS is implementing heterogenous classes in third and fourth grade. The question remains as to whether FCPS will ultimately extend E3 (& its heterogenous classes) to 5th & 6th grade as well. [/quote]

E3 leaves the kids who will proceed to advanced math less prepared than the kids who have been taking advanced math since third. Currently advanced math students push a little a head every year so that 3rd, 4th, 5th and 6th grade math are all compressed between 3rd and 5th followed by 7th grade math in 6th. The program works well for those who are in it (as reflected by SOL scores) and prepares them to either take Algebra or 8th grade math (confusingly named honors math 7) in 7th grade. E3 means that the kids moving to advanced math in 5th now have to do all of 5th, 6th, and 7th grade in two years. I'd guess that they know students will do worse (which will be reflected in SOL scores) and it will be used as an excuse to curtail advanced math in general in favor of preparing all kids for Algebra in 8th. [/quote]
Correct. We were able to spot the gaps in E3 and have been supplementing at home. It really doesnt take much time to cover the gaps since it’s just elementary math concepts. But if you don’t know that they’ve slowed down the curriculum your bright math DC could be left behind. [/quote]

And the problem is that I don't know the math curriculum well enough to know what the gaps are. We are at a pilot E3 school and it is abundantly clear that the "advanced math" kids that got E3 curriculum are behind where 5th graders in advanced math used to be. So now the 5th grade teacher is trying to catch them up to the 6th grade curriculum and SOL. This is the problem with these pilots. There isn't any follow through or plan after 4th grade. So they just dumped all these kids on the 5th grade teacher without changing the 6th grade advanced math approach at all. It's really frustrating. If they want to use E3, they have to also have a plan for 5th and 6th grade. I honestly don't care about 7th grade Algebra - I would just like my "advanced math" kid to be prepared for Math 7 Honors (which as a PP said is actually 8th grade math) and at this point half way through grade 5, I'm not convinced he'll be ready. [/quote]

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