Reply to Upper Beach Drive to Remain Closed to Cars Year Round

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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]
Can you point me to where NPS said “cars were bad for the park”?[/quote]

When it closed Beach Drive permanently.[/quote]
Did they? Have a link or evidence?

I’d hate to believe that you’re just making this up. [/quote]

So you think cars spewing carbon based exhaust into the park is ok?[/quote]
Thank you for confirming that NPS never said “cars were bad for the park” as the rationale for the decision and that you made that up. I’m glad that you are big enough to admit your error.[/quote]

Adding pollution is never good for the environment. [/quote]
Increasing congestion increases pollution. Thanks for the talk. [/quote]

There is already congestion and the park is already closed. At least the park is cleaner now than it was. And going forward it will continue to heal.[/quote]
NPS found that continued closure led to increased degradation of habitat in the park due to pedestrian users making their own trails. [/quote]

This is the salient point that's being ignored by all the people saying the park is now cleaner (HAHA! might as well just say you've never been on the trails) and this is an environmental decision.  Cars on Upper Beach weren't destroying RCP.  But during the lockdown NPS did a survey and found that pedestrians were, by tromping everywhere (leaving trash) and not sticking to the marked trails.

I don't drive to work, and never drive on Beach above Joyce.  But it's telling that the people celebrating this as a win for Mother Earth are just making things up because they sound like they *should* be true.[/quote]

NPS ultimately decided, though, that the better way to deal with the environmental issues from increased ped/bike usage during the closure of upper Beach was to develop an actual use plan that will make it possible for all those people to use the park without the environmental issues--better trail marking, more access points, more trash recepticles, etc.  Also, I would just note that nothing in the language you quoted suggests that there is not a large environmental impact from allowing cars on Beach Drive.  There are environmental impacts from both, but [b]NPS ultimately concluded the environmental impacts from peds/bikes were manageable and reducible and outweighed by the benefits of the closure[/b].[/quote]

Link, please?  Because the report describing the negative effects of hikers was published.  AFAICT the only thing NPS has "published" this time is a decision to keep a portion of Upper Beach closed to thru traffic, and people in this thread are helpfully supplying the reasoning as environmental because, again, it feels like it should be true in their hearts.[/quote]

Are you quoting the draft as "published" and ignoring the final version?  Seems disingenuous.[/quote]

No, I'm asking for a link to the NPS report that says this was done for environmental reasons.  Do you have that?  There has been no such report linked to any of the news reports about the closure I've read.  I have no reason to believe this was an environmental decision, as opposed to a way to compromise between the use groups without closing too much of the road.[/quote]

use the google machine[/quote]

The party making the assertion supports the assertion.  I believe you are making an unfounded assertion. [/quote]

Prove that to me.  You made that assertion, but don't back it up.  Yes, pedantry is fun isn't it.[/quote]

https://www.csun.edu/~hcpas003/argument.html  [quote]To support your proposition, one must present evidence.[/quote]

Basic princples of argumentation are not pedantry, but I'm not surprised you're confused.  Your turn.
[/quote]

Oh sweetie, this is an anonymous message board. You're not in debate club anymore.  Go do your own googling or admit you don't care.[/quote]

I do care that the basic premise of this thread seems to be invented from whole cloth.  And I am pretty sweet, thanks for noticing.[/quote]

You can't prove that can you, you're just asserting that now.[/quote]

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