Reply to Half of British women reach age 30 without having a child

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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]Being a mother is literally THE most important job any woman can do. What other occupation contributes more to humanity than sustaining our species?

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A lab scientist working on Covid or any number of diseases. Also climate change. Glad you think women are just walking incubators and child care workers. [/quote]

If that’s what you got out of that post, I feel absolute pity for you. [/quote]

Being a mother is not the most important job any woman can do. It is NOT a woman's job alone. There are fathers, aunts, uncles, neighbors, grandparents, church members, teachers, and community members who also act as "mothers." You don't get that child rearing is a community based activity, not some mantle a woman has because of her uterus. Birthing a child does not make a woman a mother and there are more ways women can contribute to society. In fact, wasn't the person behind the covid vaccine a woman? I am sure she will tell her kids about her achievements one day. Because women are NOT one thing. And if you don't get that, you can crawl into your hole.[/quote]

For most women, motherhood is easily the most important accomplishment of their lives. It's hard to deny that women seem to have a biological hardwiring that predisposes them to be the primary childcarer. It does not mean having children should be the only focus of a woman's life, and fathers should be heavily involved too. But, frankly, the whole idea a woman can give birth and then expect a whole "village" to jump in to help raise the children is both clueless and impractical. Most people have very limited interest in other people's children. A teacher or neighbor can never replace a mother. Even aunts and uncles are not the same as your own parents. The nuclear family model is one that provides the most support, and going from all sociological studies in modern nations, nothing can ever come close to replacing the strong support of a nuclear family arrangement - assuming, of course, it is a good one, and that is not always the case.

The delayed births in Western nations seems to be correlated with rising cost of living more than anything else. 
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You just described social changes resulting from the industrial revolution, which began in 1750. Humans have been around much longer than that. Communal arrangements were the norm for millennia. [/quote]

Nuclear families have been around for millennia too. I would refute your assertion communal arrangements were the "norm" outside hunter gatherer societies that functioned as a single clan unit. There has always been a distinct difference - in all civilized societies - between the nuclear household and the surrounding community and context. The concept of a nuclear family with a mom and dad and their children is [i]ancient[/i] and as far back as ancient Greece Aristotle talked about how the family unit was the core base unit of society, the "atom" of society.

Frankly, for all your idealizations of some hypothetical village raising your kids, I'm not sure if you really want that. Because do you know who has the closest communities of network support via family and churches and neighbors? Conservative people... somehow I suspect you don't want conservative Republican voting people having a say in how your kids are raised....

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People lived in clans for many more years than civilization. That’s 5000 years old. While nuclear families aren’t new, there was typically extended family to help. Or children just worked right alongside parents.

Are you advocating policy changes to get women out of the workforce or is this just your personal belief? [/quote]

I'm not sure what your point is. We should go back to living in barbarian clans? Roaming the wilderness? You know what those barbarian clans did when they met other barbarian clans? Tried to wipe them out. That's your kindly clan family.

Yes, families were bigger in the past so older kids can look after younger kids. Today's mothers with 1-2 kids by comparison has it much easier. Maybe we should go back to the days of cheap domestic help so most UMC mothers can have a nanny and cook once more? Is that what you want?

The idea that some extended community network all chipped in to care for the children is something that is not going to happen because people have a very limited interest in other people's children. A few recent posters talked about coming from very large extended families and even in those families the interest eventually wanes away after a certain number of grandkids. Humanity seems hardwired to have a limit to how much they can care for other people, both on a personal or abstract level. We see it in today's environment very clearly - angst of BLM while ignoring opiate ridden poverty in West Virginia, throwing fits over Rogan and Spotify while rushing out to by Apple products made in China where minority groups are systematically oppressed. It's a world of inherent contradictions that all point to one thing: people are very selfish.

All in all, I do agree somewhat with the sentiment that there's too much believing that people can be anything they want at any time and get all the help they need. There is an inherent selfishness to it. That's not how the real world works. There's always a tradeoff. There's always a price. And very few people will come to your help. The state is not a substitute because the state doesn't care about you. The government doesn't care about you. It can't. You are a mere abstract concept to a government.

As it is, most women do manage to balance a work life with family life. Most of us grew up with working mothers and most of us managed. Life is hard. Life is not going to be easy. And most people cope and get on with it instead of whining about abstract unfairness. 
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