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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][b]I find it funny how black and white grown adults can be when arguing on this forum. Yes, it's true you can get a quality education at a large state school just as you can get at an Ivy/T20. But it is also true that the academic quality of your peers is going to be universally higher at the T20.[/b] I went to a state school and I worked my butt off and got an amazing education with some great opportunities, and had some very smart peers. But the general quality of my peers and what they've accomplished nowhere compares to my son's ivy league peer group. Does that make one experience objectively better than the other in every way? No, of course not. [/quote]

I think that I generally agree with this but limiting this to the T20 is insufficient.

But what I absolutely do not agree with is the idea that outside of about 10 schools the peer group is significantly different. Those 10 schools aren't uniquely special and in a group of their own in terms of peer group. They are part of a group of about 25-30 universities and about 12-15 SLACs which all have student populations whose profiles mostly overlap and any assertion that any one of these campuses provides an environment that is significantly different than any of the others in terms of intellectual peers is just nonsense.[/quote]
Top 5 SLACs are much better and have superior outcomes to the ransoms in rank 12-15[/quote]

True and about 14-15 unis that are significantly different from the next 15-16. When you have one at a university ranked close to 30 and one ranked in T10 the differences in peers are evident. [b]The pre-TO scores in these two groups typically tell the same tale: over 75% of students at the top unis are parallel to the top 20-25% of the lower unis.[/b] [/quote]

So you’re admitting that these students can be found everywhere.

No one is arguing that the students at the top universities aren’t more “top” than at other universities. They’re pointing out that obsessing over the difference in peer group amongst schools that are all good and have strong students is misguided.[/quote]

DP 
Actually for students who are well within top 25% of the TOP schools, it would be a fairly low percentage of the lesser schools that were true intellectual peers to push them. For the median ivy kid does it matter a ton to be at a top 10 where you are average vs a 25/30 where you are top quarter, maybe or maybe not depending on personality. [b]But it matters a lot to those who are the top10-15% of the ivy kids[/b]. They would have very few intellectual peers and be an outlier at a 25-30ish. Many of those kids did that already in Magnet high schools where the median SAT was 1430 and they had less than a handful of peers they could relate to intellectually. These kids exist I know several from different magnets or top privates. [b]They are a significant percentage of them at top schools[/b] and it is genuinely refreshing to see them finally have so many that are similar, and finally meet a few who are beyond them—still outliers in the most competitive setting. [/quote]

Well, no, if you’re top 10-15% at an Ivy you aren’t really amongst your peers there either. But we aren’t talking about outliers. Those outliers are always going to struggle to find peers regardless.[/quote]

The top 10-15 % of ivy kids do find their peers there, because they are close enough to the median to relate well to most of the top half! That is the point. If you have a couple of these kids and /or were one yourself it would make sense. It is like coming home to finally relate to a large portion of peers. The top 2-3 brightest from the magnet almost always go to ivy/stanford/Mit. We know a lot of these parents well and our own kids were that way. These kids are not that rare and DCUM likely skews toward having overrepresentation of them. I heard about this from a fellow top kid parent. Our kids did competitive orchestra and JHU CTY camps together. This website used to be great for the super bright but lately anyone who wants the right fit is told State publics are the same, All schools are the same. They just are not. And the differences are very important to a lot of kids at the top. [/quote]
Neither competitive orchestra or JHU CTY are indicators of being so intelligent you wouldn’t be serviced well by a state university. These students are very rare, and often end up in PhD programs with top fellowships. A majority of Ivy League students would’ve been challenged at a state flagship.[/quote]

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