Reply to dont be in the 60th to 99th percentile in income

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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]hat said the challenge is finding high income students who are absolutely committed to staying the full four years as well as academically willing to put in the effort to satisfy the graduation requirements that are tied to the university ranking.  This is no trivial challenge, finding high income students who are also studious.   [/quote]

That's not a challenge at all. The paper shows there are plenty of kids in the parental income 97-100% range who have high test scores and high GPA (i.e. they are studious). The trope that rich kids are lazy and stupid is simply false.[/quote]

Nobody is implying rich kids are lazy and stupid.

From a university point of view, finding high income and studious is a challenge.

Financial aid is the carrot the university offers to make a low income student to do one thing: 1) stay committed for full four years and graduate.  Whereas the university is asking a high income student do two things: 1) go ask your parents or get a loan but pay full tuition 2) please stay here for four years and put in the effort to graduate.  Within the high income student pool, the legacy students bring in the additional attribute of emotional commitment which may or may not be present in a random high income student.  [/quote]
If these colleges weren't so stupidly expensive, then they wouldn't have to worry about #2.  UMC could afford full pay without loans if they lowered the cost, but like expensive cars, the colleges like to keep it expensive to create a "in the club" experience.[/quote]

why shouldn't a for profit university raise prices if it can still keep demand?

Apple's iPhone is celebrated as an all American business success every time it raises prices, and everyone - high income as well as low income happily pay $1400+ for owning it over time. Same with other branded luxuries, resort vacations, etc... As long as everyone pays the same, no one complains.  Imagine what would happen if Apple changes its phone sales to something like half of their phone purchases to lower half will be funded by the upper half based on family income, color of their skin or some other social factor?

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The colleges mentioned in the article are NONprofits with tremendous tax benefits although they act like for-profits.[/quote]

they are nonprofit, but Private. all non-profit means profits made should be reinvested back into the college.  There is no law that says non-profits should not maximize profits.  [/quote]
Sure, but all this talk of "oh we have to charge that much so that we can cover the non rich kids" is BS.  If they lowered the costs, more people could afford to pay for it without taking out stupid sized loans.[/quote]

So what exactly do you propose a university eliminate or reduce to charge lower tuition?  Most 80k+ schools have smaller class sizes---so would you prefer your kid sit in lectures with 300-500 kids for most of their classes?  That way they can fire 1/3 of the professors.  Let's go back to 1 cafeteria on campus for the 6K undergrads and make it just a normal college cafeteria like we had 30+ years ago.....2 entrees, salad bar, cereal and 1 dessert option for each dinner.  No specialty dining or options because those truly cost money and it's much cheaper to run a basic cafeteria in one place everyone just has to walk 20 mins to get to.

Forget the new chemistry labs---kids can squeeze 100 into the lab space for their Orgo Chem lab instead of 25---more partners, less learning for you to do hands on.

I suppose I lived without shuttle busses on my campus 30+ years ago, so kids can just walk the 1.5 miles from one end to the other even at -5 degrees and 11pm, same for the campus security/safe walk---we lived without it, kids can today as well.

Yes they can cut some administration salaries, but the fact is universities cost a lot to run.  Dorms cost more than apartments because they are not cheap---the RAs/RHD/services provided to help kids on campus cost money.  Maintaining old dorms is expensive as well.

[/quote]

A significant chunk of the increase in college costs is administrative salaries and expenses. During college tours, I was struck by the sheer number of support programs that didn’t exist when I was in college. Back then they let you in and it was sink or swim. Now there are countless counseling and tutoring services — study skills, 24 hour writing center, specialized tutoring, identity support groups, etc etc. As I understand it, the goal is to increase graduation rates, particularly for students from disadvantaged backgrounds. That’s great, but it’s not cheap, and a largely hidden cost of expanding the populations served by these institutions. [/quote]
All excellent services that should be available for college students.  Happy to pay for those, incase my kid needs it.  If this helps disadvantaged students make it thru college in 4-5 years, I'm happy to pay.  The benefits for getting those students thru college and onto great careers is too good to give up.    Adjusting to college and navigating your way thru is much more challenging for an 18yo whose parents didn't attend college, the lack of home support can be huge.  Add in often times lower income and the issues/stress of worrying how to pay for everything is added stress many do not understand.[/quote]

Good for you, I'd rather avoid the decades of debt and forgo the counseling services. [/quote]

Not to mention that student debt is a huge driver of mental illness in adulthood. Saddle a 20 year old with 100k in debt and watch what happens ..(nothing good)[/quote]

And they go from having 4 years of therapy to not being able to afford therapy the second they graduate [/quote]

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