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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]Hi it's me, the one who just started this whole saga an hour or so ago. I am now on page 34.

I am definitely way less sympathetic to Sonya, et al., at this point, but I still do not trust Dawn either. She is not the amazing person people are claiming in order to contrast her with Chunky Monkeys.

Dawn was trying to get revenge on Sonya as shown here: https://rottenindenmark.org/2021/10/10/identifying-the-bad-art-friend-is-easy/

Additionally, I am pretty positive that this 'mistext' she admits here was not an accident: https://twitter.com/kidneygate/status/1447626879788277765/photo/1

At this point I feel they are both manipulative just in different ways.

I am open to my mind being changed more, however. 
[/quote]

I’ll get yelled at but whatever. Rotten in Denmark is a shit source, and I’m well and truly over people still slamming Dorland. And I won’t stop posting it. Telling people to actually read the whole damned thing is less disruptive than people coming in late and saying a kidney “brag” negates the donation.[/quote]

That PP is only on p. 34 and is still reading and learning. It's okay. I am very firmly pro-Dorland now and I was probably "both sides made mistakes" on around that page, because the facts were still unfurling. The thread is quieted down, it's okay for someone to read and update as she goes along. I like the updates. [/quote]

I don’t agree for a few reasons but the main one is that I feel like “both sides erred” as the de facto wise-owl take in all situations is a terribly destructive setting, and it’s IMO a coward’s perch. Not intending that as ad hominem against any particular poster; this is a default social setting that I vehemently disagree with. It lets a lot of abusive behavior escape any form of accountability because the critical eye will make distinctions that get washed away with both sides rationalizations. Part of me wants Dorland not to mediate, which I know might be financial suicidal, because it will render this nightmare and plagiarism and workplace harassment a nullity to too many, and the thought gives me anguish. Yes, I know how that sounds. [/quote]

I agree with you strenuously about the dangers of “both sides”

Here (I’m not the new poster and have followed the saga extensively but not participated a lot here) I am quite pro dorland. I think grubstreet leadership should be hanging their heads in embarrassed shame, that the chunky monkeys are a mean girls clique (maybe an exception for Calvin), and Larson herself is an unethical writer who’s refusal to admit that she was a bad friend and made an illegal and lazy artistic choice will likely end any chances of larger mainstream success. And Celeste Ng needs to do a lot of self reflection.

I have zero criticism for Dawn’s actions surrounding and related to her kidney donation and subsequent advocacy.

I do however disagree with posters who say that after this article that they believe anyone who ends up with a similar reputation is likely being “framed.”

Dawn ended up where she is because she was a fringe member of a social group and one prominent member of that group wronged her and did not want to accept that culpability so the rest of the group rallied around the prominent figure to soothe her ego and in the process fully convinced themselves it was justified in order to not feel guilty themselves. People will rationalize a lot to not feel guilty. So they all helped Sonya feel less guilty and wiped away their own sins in the process. It was a no brained because Sonya was the inner circle. I have seen this happen in groups, especially groups of women, a lot.

That said, I also have had a friend that is like the type of person Kolker tries to paint, and I don’t dislike her because of misogyny. She and I became friends because she was the subject of bullying and I spoke out for her, publicly, in an all girls school. We were friends for decades. She is not a 100% bad person and I could so see her retroactively portrayed the way Dawn is in a situation like this  and I have had trouble reading all through this and retaining my unbiased opinion of Dawn because of this friend.

This friend is someone who, after a long long time of knowing her, you see that she is a very selfish and insecure person who is constantly positioning herself to be a victim. Of something. And once she has decided she is a victim of whatever she then is hyper focused on it, talks about it absolutely non stop (for years, she will rehash wrongs for literal years) and claim to be deeply traumatized by the people who hurt her.

And the first, second, third times this happens, you believe her and hug her and hear her feelings, even if you think perhaps whatever it is that happened is being a bit overblown. But eventually, when you’ve known someone like this for a long time and you have been through the cycle with them a few times, you find yourself repulsed by them. All the sympathy and pity and love curdles when it goes unreciprocated for so long, when the genuine nature of the complaints begins to sour, when you see that she /he is sucking you into the same pattern again and again to validate their latest obsession.

Anyway, I’m not sure Dawn is this person, I’m also not entirely sure she’s not a similar flavor though. It doesn’t change the fact that this group of people were unprofessional and cruel and that she didn’t deserve this. But just as it is misogynistic to label certain female traits like sticking up for yourself and sticking to your guns as bad, it’s also wrong to deny people the true feeling they have when they feel like they know the person Kolker is describing. And just like Dawn’s “gut feeling” that something was off is really hard to ‘prove’ in the moment. It is similarly difficult to ‘prove’ this type of friend is extremely toxix.[/quote]

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