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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]PP--I applaud your diligence in further investigating this rather obscure group of early Christians.  They are of interest in their own right in the context of the various early theological struggles of nascent Christianity.

But I have to say, I have really, really missed what possible relevance the Ebionites have to Islam's lack of belief in the trinity.  There is no evidence this group existed in 7th century western Arabia.  Nestorians did exist, and Mohammed was said to have been influenced by a Nestorian monk, whose name I recall as Bahira.  (Don't hold me to this--am not as diligent as you in looking this stuff all up for purposes of this thread).  Nestorians emphasized the human nature of Christ, as does Islam, with the difference that Nestorian theology had some convoluted link to Christ's divinity and Islam doesn't.

I also don't get why the beliefs of one Christian convert to Islam, who appears to have an extremely small sphere of influence, should inform anyone's thinking on the merits of the trinity, Islam's lack of belief thereof, and the essential truth or not of Islam. I don't see why what this mysterious Dirks thinks or not matters at all.

Islam cannot accept the trinity because if the prophet Jesus is also God come to earth, a later prophet, eg Mohammed, is redundant.[/quote]

I'm with you, I'm not sure why OP thought this was relevant either. I wouldn't have bothered, except that OP keeps insisting that Dirks and the Ebionites somehow (1) "prove" her point about the Trinity and therefore (2) "debunk" (OP's word) all the rest of Christianity. For example, OP claimed just yesterday that Dirks proves she's right on the Trinity at 09/12/2014 16:58.

OP has a long history on DCUM of claiming she "won" arguments she clearly lost. OP is the type of poster who links to things she hasn't read herself, and continues to insist that she's right until you refute every single angle of her obscure links. Given my own happiness in nerdy pursuits like this one, I decided to investigate a little.

Next time OP claims she "won" the Trinity argument, therefore she "debunked" all of Christianity, and therefore everybody here should convert to Islam... somebody can call her out. If I'm not on DCUM, anybody who thinks that OP is full of it can simply cut and paste from my post above.

[b]OP's claim that Dirks is, or ever was, a Harvard Divinity School professor--no words. He's practiced psychology for the last 20 years.
[/b]
We agree, I think, that 7th century Arabia was a veritable marketplace for ideas as well as commerce. One of the sources I linked to says the Ebionites may have influenced the later Nestorians. It seems like a stretch though--given (a) the several hundred years that elapsed between the Ebionites and the Nestorians, and (b) the fact that we have no original Ebionite manuscripts and instead we are relying on people who disagreed with them--to hinge any argument on the Ebionites themselves. Let alone for OP to keep insisting that this "debunks" Christianity or that everybody should therefore convert to Islam. I agree with your argument that Mohammed had personal reasons for proving that Jesus was not "divine" and therefore another prophet--Mohammed himself--was needed. None of OP's arguments make sense to me.

Call me agnostic on the whole Trinity issue.

[/quote]

Yes, he graduated from Harvard Divinity School. I do not know if he taught there. Here is his full biography:

We are very sorry that with his writing and speaking obligations Dr. Dirks can't fit in time to do facebook. To contact him directly please use our web page jeraldanddebradirks.com or our email dirksjf_dls@yahoo.com. Thank you. Peace, Debra L. Dirks
Description
Dr. Dirks is a former minister (deacon) of the United Methodist Church. He holds a Master's degree in Divinity from Harvard University and a Doctorate in Psychology from the University of Denver. Author of "The Cross and the Crescent: An Interfaith Dialogue between Christianity and Islam" (2001), and "Abraham: The Friend of God" (2002). He has published over 60 articles in the field of clinical psychology, and over 150 articles on Arabian horses.

Dr Dirks-
"There is some irony in the fact that the supposedly best, brightest, and most idealistic of ministers-to-be are selected for the very best of seminary education, e.g. that offered at that time at the Harvard Divinity School. The irony is that, given such an education, the seminarian is exposed to ... much ... historical truth. .. As such, it is no real wonder that almost a majority of such seminary graduates leave seminary, not to “fill pulpits”, where they would be asked to preach that which they know is not true, but to enter the various counseling professions. Such was also the case for me, as I went on to earn a master’s and doctorate in clinical psychology."

Dr. Jerald F. Dirks received his Bachelor of Arts (philosophy) from Harvard College in 1971, his Master of Divinity from Harvard Divinity School in 1974, his Master of Arts (clinical child psychology) from the University of Denver in 1976, his Doctor of Psychology (Psy.D.) degree in clinical psychology from the University of Denver in 1978, and his sessions program certificate in Islamic studies from Imam Muhammad ibn Saud Islamic University in 1998. In 1969, he obtained his License to Preach from the United Methodist Church and was ordained into the Christian ministry (deaconate) by the United Methodist Church in 1972. He converted to Islam in 1993 and completed the ‘Umrah and Hajj in 1999.

His vocational history includes over five years teaching in American colleges and universities and over 20 years spent in the private practice of psychotherapy. In addition, he has taught at the middle school level at two different private Islamic schools and has served as the psychoeducational consultant at one private Islamic school.

Dr. Dirks is the author or co-author of over 60 published articles in the behavioral sciences (primarily in psychosomatic medicine), over 140 published articles on the Arabian horse and its history, and over 220 published articles or formal presentations on Islam, comparative religion, and private Islamic education in America. He has lectured widely on Islam at American universities (Tabor College, University of Kansas, University of Denver, Oklahoma State University, Missouri State University, Wayne State University, University of Michigan, University of Pittsburgh, University of Alabama at Birmingham, and Georgetown University), in American mosques (in Arizona, California, Colorado, Georgia, Illinois, Kansas, Michigan, New York, Oklahoma, Pennsylvania, Tennessee, Texas, Utah, and Virginia), and at regional and national conventions of the major Islamic organizations (ISNA, ICNA, and MAS). In addition, he has been interviewed about Islam by newspapers in California, Colorado, Missouri, and Saudi Arabia and by television stations in Kansas, New York, Texas, Utah, Canada, and the United Arab Emirates. He is the author of four books that explore the commonalities and differences among the three Abrahamic religions (Islam, Christianity, and Judaism): The Cross and the Crescent, now in its second printing; Abraham, The Friend of God; Understanding Islam--A Guide for the Judaeo-Christian Reader; and The Abrahamic Faiths--Judaism, Christianity, and Islam. His fifth book, Muslims in American History--A Forgotten Legacy was published in 2006 and celebrates the centuries-old history of Muslims in America. His sixth book, Letters to My Elders in Islam, was published in 2008. Dr. Dirks has also proofread and/or edited several books for other authors.

Dr. Dirks is available for lectures on a variety of topics, for conducting all-day workshops on how to perform Da’wah in America most effectively and on Muslims in American history, for consultation to private Islamic schools and Islamic public relations efforts, and for editing and/or proofing the manuscripts of other authors.[/quote]

[b]You remind me of Drew Barrymore in 50 First Dates, where she had some kind of brain disorder that caused her brain to erase it's short term memory every morning…because every time you accuse me of using Dirks or the Ebionites to "debunk the entire Christian faith" and accuse me of telling "everyone to convert to Islam" I tell you that my evidence doesn't do that and isn't intended for that. But then the next morning you wake up again with the same accusations. 
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