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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]Winner if everyone was studying an extra hour or two a day things would be very different same with sports

There needs to be a way to differentiate between [b]talent and spending more time at something[/b].  Aap should be based on talent not time spent preparing.[/quote]

This idea that there is such a thing as 'intelligence' or 'talent' that is meaningful without effort, and that it is somehow more 'real' than achievements that are worked for is a distortion (one that is more common in American culture than many others).

I think the difference to me is that spending more time at something to get good at the actual thing (e.g., reading, writing, mathematics, arts, science, sports) is worthwhile, what I think would be problematic is if you are spending most of the time to beat some artificial hoop (e.g., Cogat test) rather than spending the effort to excel at what actually matters.  I get why people do it, but it's a sign of a flawed system.[/quote]

This is spot on. We have a cultural problem when it is more important to prove that you have the skill than it is to have the skill. This is why standardized exams are deeply problematic - because in many cases they test only for the raw skill rather than the ability to leverage the skill towards the greater good.[/quote]

Standardized tests aren't meant to be used in isolation to determine someone's potential.  That's why they use standardized tests + grades: one shows raw abilities, one shows that you can put in the work.[/quote]

That's why they're optional at many schools these days. They just aren't all that meaningful.[/quote]

I know! More and more the leading schools aren't using these things. [b]They just aren't that helpful in determining much of anything[/b].[/quote]

That's not why schools are not using standardized tests.  The problem is they don't give the results that schools want.  That's why (some) schools are moving away from them. [/quote]

Brutally, indefensibly false.

Colleges are businesses. If it was in their best interests to continue the outdated practice of overemphasizing standardized exam performance, that’s what they’d do.

It’s not, so they don’t.[/quote]

Your take is so wrong. I was at a university for over a decade. And now run a business. Universities may have some business like characteristics but there is no way to say that colleges are businesses. [/quote]

… They’re not-for-profit businesses, mostly, but they are absolutely businesses. [/quote]

Not true. For one, most state funded instititions are driven significantly by political considerations - because of the state funding. also faculty politics is a big deal. even in private institutions, lots of other factors involved. [/quote]

You speak as if businesses aren't driven at least in part by political considerations. Indeed, they are much more so than most colleges and universities.

I sense there's a point you're trying to beat around, but you're not really making it.[/quote]

You sense right. Don't patronize. just because an org has metrics doesn't mean it is a business. there's more but too much breaths. [/quote]

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