Reply to why are cars allowed in the National Arbortetum? Why? Why? WHYYYY?

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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]

The presence of cars does limit access. When people use roads in cars, that makes it difficult for people who are not in cars to use those roads.[/quote]

No, it limits access in the exact manner you would prefer it.  You can still walk on those roads.  In a place like the arboretum, in many areas there are places you can walk off of the roads if you prefer.

You have every bit the same access to the arboretum (via walking, bike, uber, bus, etc) whether there are cars or not.  [/quote]

As you said: it limits access.[/quote]

Only if you choose to be so limited.  Absent your choice, it is fully open to you.[/quote]

Choice? Not everyone has a car. Not everyone can drive. It's exactly the same as the argument that there has be to be car access because not everyone can walk or bike.[/quote]

Except that it’s served by bus (and taxis and Uber, for people who don’t have a problem with the business model).

Do you complain about anyplace not near a Metro stop or walkable from your home?[/quote]

OK, so the bus drops you off a few blocks away from the Arboretum, and then you...

It's just a fact that cars on roads limit access for people who are walking or biking. You may believe that the benefits of cars on road outweigh the disadvantages of limiting access to people who are walking and biking, but the limited access is simply not up for debate, just like gravity isn't up for debate. [/quote]

Look, you’re arguing with someone who goes to the arboretum to... walk. But I can also clearly see that not everyone has that option.[/quote]

But that’s not why cars are allowed everywhere. The arboretum could remain perfectly accessible, even moreso, if cars were limited. [b]Disabled people could still drive in, park, and access the features. They could be supplied with scooters.[/b] The reason cars have the run of the place has nothing to do with the goal of accessibility. It’s lack of deliberate planning, combined with an anachronistic idea of “autotouring” in national parks that’s already on its way out, and was always a bad fit for such a relatively small space. [/quote]

New poster. Not one to whom you're responding. Re: the bold: This demonstrates your lack of understanding of the myriad issues involve with accessibility. "They could be supplied with scooters." OK. Do you have even a remote idea how much a single scooter costs? Thousands, for a safe and stable one. How much are you personally willing to pony up in new admission fees or whatever to help fund a fleet of scooters that would be kept on standby? How much should those who would need scooters pay to rent one for...an hour, a few hours, most of the day? Because that will end up being how it's done--rentals--unless you generously donate quite a few very pricey scooters. And what happens when the last scooter is taken out and a person who needs one turns up but there's no scooter? So, a reservation system will take care of that problem--reserve, and don't you dare turn up on a whim if you need a scooter because we can't guarantee you one. And on and on. By the way, have you ever tried actually driving one yourself? I'm betting not. Some models require the person to be able to use their hands to squeeze the handlebars to make the scooter run. Try doing that for a long period--or even a short period--gripping hard to keep the scooter running. Even models that don't run that way can require users to use their arms and hands a lot.

Before someone leaps in to say, "Off topic! This isn't about scooters!": My point is that people who have no real experience with accessibility issues blithely toss out "solutions" like this one. Provide them with scooters. Provide them with wheelchairs. (An earlier poster correctly noted that wheelchairs must be pushed and doing so over distances, hills, etc. isn't always a realistic option.)

The intention may be good but the suggestions as made here are showing a lack of understanding of how scooters and wheelchairs work, or don't, in places like the arboretum.

My MIL in the UK used scooters for many years at nature preserves and other similar places. Locations far more "wild" than the Arboretum. The issues like having to reserve, there being very limited numbers of scooters available at any time, having to deal with models that required a strong hand grip, etc. are all for real. We were always very grateful for the organization that provided those scooters at so many places! But this is also why I can't see scooters working at the Arboretum as THE "solution" for accessibility. As ONE option to offer, for rental? Sure. As the way for people with mobility issues to be expected to see this place, period? Not very feasible.

I guess its' good that the PP (is that you, OP?) thought about providing scooters but the reality is that scooters will be expensive and very limited availability.

And the Arboretum is fine if you don't go at peak times on good-weather days when a pandemic has made everyone stir-crazy. The dramatic "why why WHYYYY" of this thread's original post is just that--drama. [/quote]

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