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Reply to "Massive home addition causes confusion in Fairfax County neighborhood"
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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]Greenbriar is a mess. Has anyone actually driven through it?! Shudders. One of DS's team mates lived there.[/quote] There is nothing wrong with the neighborhood. It isn’t shiny and new, but it isn’t “a mess”[/quote] I wouldn't call it a mess, but it looks like a middle middle class neighborhood filled with 1950s-1960s split levels, some of which are quite poorly maintained. People are melting down about architectural cohesion when the neighborhood architecture isn't even nice. [/quote] It was built in the late 60s-early 70s What is wrong with a middle class neighborhood? Are there some properties that aren’t well maintained? Sure. No HOA, remember? [/quote] Surely you knew there wasn't an HOA when you bought the home.[/quote] Yes, we knew there was no HOA. And?[/quote] Then you knew you couldn't control what other people would build.[/quote] Most in this neighborhood didn’t realize that the county zoning office would approve a monstrosity like this. What everyday citizen gets deep into zoning to figure out that the county would allow a 3 story Motor Lodge to be attached to modest cape cod?[/quote] Are you saying you were oblivious to basic zoning requirements? Or that you expected the county to illegally deny a permit for a legal addition? It is troubling either way, but I'm curious.[/quote] It’s troubling that someone just going along in life doesn’t spend hours thinking about the outer limits of what county zoning might allow? No, we honestly didn’t realize. We’re not asking them to deny legal additions. If this is within the rules, there isn’t much to be done. The only move any of can make moving forward is to try to work with county officials to change things moving forward.[/quote] You're surprised someone might want to build something at the maximum allowable height? Or it isn't something you cared enough about to make it an issue? Pretty crappy of you to later decide it is important after someone spent $100k on their home. If there was a substantive violation, that would be one thing. But you've just been looking for a technicality to kill it. And I think that's an awful thing to do to a family.[/quote] It also isn’t very nice for someone to figure out the maximum limits of a structure that can be legally built and then technically follow those limits without any thought at all for how the structure would look and how it would affect the neighbors. It isn’t very nice to do something that will make it harder for everyone on this block to sell their homes someday and then they’ll only be able to sell for less than they could have had this structure never been built. It isn’t very nice to think only about oneself and not care about how one’s actions will affect others. And to be surprised when those you are harming have the nerve to ask questions about what you’re doing- well, that pretty much takes the cake. [/quote] They knew what the structure looked like and liked it. That's why they built it. While you may think it's rude to build without consulting with the neighbors, it's definitely not required and shouldn't be expected. What would happen if the neighbor said, "We want you to cut off the top floor." Mike would then say, "But we want/need all those bedrooms?" Then the neighbor said, "But it's uglier that way." How would this be resolved? It really sounds like the neighbors want the addition to be done more tastefully and expensively. If that's what the neighbors want, they should chip in to fund the difference. Apparently, it would benefit the neighbors, too, and the homeowner is fine with how the existing structure looks so doesn't really benefit. [/quote] No, the neighbors would probably prefer that the owners here didn’t take an action that will harm everyone on the street by reducing the value of their homes. I don’t live in this neighborhood, but I live in one that is similar. We have a very nice community of people who help their neighbors and have an interest in living in a pleasant neighborhood to raise their kids and, yes, everyone would like their property values to increase over time. Sometimes the economy is bad and values decrease, everyone knows that. But it would be rightfully upsetting to anyone if their property value went down because one owner decided to do something to his property that lowered his own and everyone else’s property values. I imagine this homeowner would not have been happy if someone on his street did something that would make his home worth less than it would have been worth when it’s time to sell, or even take a loan on the house to finance improvements. [/quote] This is part of why your home should never be treated as an investment. Many things impact property values that are entirely outside of your control. Lots of risk, and it's important to accept that. There's undeveloped land that is being sold to a commercial developer within eyeshot of my house. Previously it was a wooded area. That sucks for me, but I have zero right to that land. It was zoned commercial, and I have no basis for demanding that the property owner not develop it. Property all around you can change at any time. And it often isn't in a way you live. You have to deal with other people having property rights too. And, unfortunately, we don't have any right to our property values being preserved or going up. [/quote] It’s nice that for some people losing money on a house doesn’t matter because they were so smart as to never treat their home as an investment. For many hard working middle class people, getting less than what they might have when they sell their home can make a difference for their futures. And confronted with that possibility, you certainly can’t blame them for asking questions. The homeowners building the addition will also see a decrease in their potential property value, but since they were making the choices and decisions about what they were building, they were able to take that into account and decide that they were okay with that. The other homeowners on the block obviously had no say, so they are dealing with a situation that has been thrust upon them. The irony is that this family says they are building this to take care of elderly parents. Others on the block might end up with less for their own care when they are elderly because of this project. [/quote] Zero percent chance the owners get less than they paid for the house. Will they make back the money spent on the addition? Most don’t in the short-term. Maybe they don’t view their primary home as an investment either. Understanding property owners’ rights with their own land has nothing to do with being rich. I borrowed max against my retirement accounts and walked dogs to afford the down payment on my first and only house that I purchased two years ago (at the top of the market!). But I have full understanding that I don’t own the land around me and that because I don’t live in an HOA, my neighbors can do what they want. One neighbor has missing shutters, peeling paint, house painted different colors, a cracked sewer pipe, and trash cans sitting out even though it’s a “nice neighborhood” and his house is likely worth over $1 MM. I don’t have control over that. Nor do I have control over the forested area being developed. Those are just risks you bear with home ownership. I’m sorry the Greebrier neighbors didn’t understand that. [/quote] You misunderstand the point. The post above is not saying that the homeowners would get less than they paid for the house. What is being pointed out here is that the house will sit on the market longer because there will be fewer buyers interested in a house that looks like this. With fewer interested buyers, there would be less competition on price, so the price is likely to end up not as high as it might have been had they not built this particular structure. Also, any comparables in the neighborhood will also be lower because fewer buyers will be interested in living on this street and the ones who are willing to live there will expect a bargain price, which will result in sales prices being lower than they would have been had this particular structure not been built. Everyone on the street loses in the long run. [/quote] Pure speculation. Some people might be thrilled to get that kind of square footage in a neighborhood with such great schools. Inexpensively increasing square footage is consistently the best ROI when it comes to property upgrades renovations. Can't say what it will do to other homes, but my parents had numerous ugly, massive rebuilds on their street. They sold their original cottage, which had appreciated over 300% in less than two decades and way higher than the zip code overall. In other words, you really don't know what it will do to property values. [/quote] Well, you never know. Some people might want square footage, even in a big box that was built as cheaply as possible. And let’s face it, the schools are fine, but they’re not in one of the pyramids that people are fighting to get into. So maybe there will be a slew of people bidding up the price of a house with a large, ugly, lower quality addition in a middling school pyramid. It could happen. But I certainly wouldn’t count on it. [/quote] All 7 and 8 out 10 rated schools are pretty desirable... Our neighborhood has all 5s and barely anyone uses public schools. They used to be 3s. [/quote] I have no idea where you live, but in Fairfax County, Chantilly is considered a middling school pyramid. It’s fine, but no one is making sacrifices to get their kids in there. If anything, there are lots of complaints about how crowded the HS is, so a lot of buyers are going to steer toward more desirable Fairfax County school pyramids. [/quote] I like in a part of FFX County where the schools are rated 3, 4, and 5 out of 10. Chantilly is the 9th best high school in the district out of 30 and the 15th best in the entire state. Chantilly is much more economically accessible than many of the other pyramids like Langley, McLean, and Oakton. Sorry 9th best in the state is "middling" to you. [/quote] Nobody is willing to live in a substandard, albeit big, house just send their kids to Chantilly. A buyer willing to live in that house will expect a bargain. [/quote] DP. I don't think anyone expects that house will sell for the same amount as a more traditional 5-6 bedroom home, but the point is that there are people that will accept the aesthetics for the size and location.[/quote] Yes, but they will expect a bargain price. They would have been better off selling the house and using the additional money that’s being poured into this thing to buy a bigger house. They are being penny wise and pound foolish. [/quote] I don't think you're thinking that through. I think a 6br home in this school cluster would end up well outside their price range. [/quote] This. Plus inventory issues. There are literally zero 6 bed homes for sale zoned for Chantilly. The 5 beds are close to a million or over a million. Mike and fam bought their house for 488k. If the addition costs even 350k, they’re still coming out way ahead of a move. [/quote] PP doesn't actually care about the family. In his mind, equity is more important than housing. Thou shall not value human lives above the mighty dollar![/quote] The family can do what they want to provide their housing. I hope that they have long, healthy, and happy lives in their house. At the same time, they are deluding themselves if they think they are going to make a lot of money when they sell this house. There is not a huge market for a house of this size that is poorly designed and built. Financially, years down the line, when all is totaled up, they would have been better off to sell and buy a bigger house. They don’t want to hear that and they will argue about it but the truth is the truth. [/quote] DP. They probably don't intend to sell unless they have to. Which is unfortunate, because the main structure won't last forever. Then what? They would have been better off in the long run by tearing down and rebuilding altogether. [/quote] What are the issues with the main structure? Has it been damaged or weakened somehow by the addition being built? [/quote] It's 55-60 year old tract home construction.[/quote] And?[/quote] The construction quality is crap. Do you think it will last another 60 years?[/quote] Then that will be a neighborhood-wide problem, since all the houses are 55-60 year old tract home construction...[/quote] Yes. Have you never heard of a "teardown"? [/quote] Then you should feel better about this addition of you're convinced the lot will need to be leveled in a handful of years anyway.[/quote] No, that was sort of my point wondering what Mike is going to do in another 10/20/30 years when the main property is ready to be demolished. [/quote] Wow... It must be incredible to be you. In your reality, everyone has an extra $400k laying around, and people can just tear down houses once they've decided they're too old.[/quote] Teardowns are hardly a new concept I invented, they have been happening in Arlington and Vienna for years. I'm curious what would you say the useful life of these older, cheaply made structures might be? Unless you think they would last indefinitely, these homes will be torn down and replaced at some point in the future. It's only a question of when. In the long run, yes I think it would have saved Mike a lot of money to have just started over from scratch and been done with it. [/quote]
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