Reply to New Charter Schools for Next Year?

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Reply to "New Charter Schools for Next Year?"

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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]

How to make them successful, screen out all the low-performing kids and those with troubling behaviors. I mean how students with ankle bracelets do you see at Charter schools, or other extreme behavioral issues. Go into any DCPS school that is low-performing and you see an abundance along with a huge population of low-literate students. Go to any large DCPS non-application high school during lunch-time and before a holiday. There a lot police on standby, does that happen at a Charter. It's the kids STUPID!!!![/quote]

I agree with your premise, but not your conclusion. To the extent charter schools are more successful than DCPS, it is at least partly because they can choose the "best" kids. Kids are only in charter schools if their parents have enough time/literacy/attention to enter them in the lottery in the first place, which means that low-performing DCPSs are stuck with the kids with the least involved/educated parents.

Also, charter schools have much more flexibility about expelling/counseling out kids with low test scores/poor behavior, meaning that DCPS is stuck with them: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/dc-schools-insider/post/charter-schools-suspend-expel-students-at-widely-varying-rates/2012/09/21/8b72ffa0-03f2-11e2-91e7-2962c74e7738_blog.html[/quote]

All of you, please then explain the success of a school model like Appletree.  My kid is only in K, so she's not done the rest of elementary or beyond yet, but a classroom at Appletree may be more economically and racially diverse than some of the most underperforming charters, but after being there for 2 yrs and also after having taught Elementary school in the past, I can tell you that the majority of kids in any given class are absolutely the same types of kids at the lowest performing schools in DC.  I've been around the kids... I've met their parents... and Appletree does not expel or get rid of the "bad kids".

I know it's only PS and PK, but there is a DIFFERENCE in how they handle things.  Both yeas I saw amazing changes in the most off the chain kids, how they behaved, what they knew... that model works.

And who do you think goes to Kipp schools??  Even if Kipp does kick out some kids (and I don't know that they do, I've just heard people assume they do).  But have you ever been in a Kipp school?  It is almost ALL the same kids.  And yet they have dramatically better behavioral and academic outcomes.  Do the kids end up looking like Sidwell kids?  Of course not.  But what is awful about how you're all talking about this is as if some charters (and some creative DCPS as well!) are not making a difference.

If a school consistently shows that kids from the group you're all talking about actually do better... consistently... who are you to dismiss whatever they're doing differently as not worth doing at all?[/quote]

Because the Kipp parents took the time to fill out an application form (one assumes that they can read or if not care enough to have someone else read the form) and go through the application process hence they have already made some commitment/investment in their child's education, the students wear uniform and obey the rules, if not there are consequences, misbehaving students are just transferred to another school because DCPS has to serve all children at their neighborhood  (high schools routinely transfer students using "safety transfers", some high school in DC have specific wings for SpEd students with Emotional Disturbance who although not in the same classes for the most part interact with other students in the hallways, lunch, and during some activities, some high schools have "gang" issues within the school, many parents are non-responsive to intervention, I could go on. There is no way that Charters teach the same children as the majority of high schools, they have "SOME" of the same students but they have more diversity within their population. by diversity I'm not taking about race.  If anyone does not believe this just go and take some time to volunteer at one of the cities low-performing high schools or watch the Frontline video about "Metropolitan high school", most of those students had been expelled already, this school was their last option.

Is the the children's fault, no, but honestly at Ballou, Coolidge, Anacostia, Dunbar they are dealing with completely different issues that are above and beyond what an "effective teacher"  can do in the classroom by teaching a lesson on "Shakespeare".  It all sounds good on paper, but it really is the "students STUPID". There are no miracles here, and once we begin to realize that we can begin the hard work. Charters and DCPS are different and need different resources and services to help all children be successful. [/quote]

How much time have you actually spent at Ballou and Anacostia high schools?  And over what period of time?  As someone who has spent a lot of time in both in the last 5 years, I agree with the PP who said you are clueless if you only speak in absolutes.  Both schools have come a very long way in the last few years, and you can tell the moment you walk in the front door how much has changed.  Better attendance, slightly rising test scores and improving graduation rates at both also tell the story, although dramatic results will take more time to see.  Point is, there are better ways of educating the most at risk kids than DC was doing.  Lessons can be learned from charters, and also from other regular public schools.  Stop talking ignorantly as if there are no improvements that can lead to better results for these kids.  Neither school will probably ever look like School Without Walls, but there are still dramatic improvements that can be made.

Re: Kipp, guess what?  Parents have to fill out paperwork regardless of what schools their kids go to.  And Kipp does major outreach to Wards 7 & 8.  Are you really that uninformed that it requires being a typical Type A DCUM parent to hear about and apply to Kipp if you're a really under served/high risk parent?  Sometimes even parents who, sadly, don't give a crap what school their kid goes to, if the kid can get to Kipp without parent taking them, there are kids who fit that exact profile.

Which leads me to ask, those of you blaming the kids and dismissing the possibility of actual improvements in the outcomes for those kids, how much time have you actually spent in Ballou, Anacostia, or Kipp schools?  Because it sounds like you don't know Kipp's population and have no clue how far the other two have come.  Obnoxious of you to be so dismissive without knowing what you're talking about.[/quote]

I'm not blaming the kids, I'm blaming those that keep saying that the population is the same at both schools is the same so what works at a Charter works for DCPS!!!!  I've spent lots of time in SE because I live there and know plenty about what is going on. I know that those parents who are invested for the most part choose to send their children elsewhere, that leaves those that remain and their teachers that remain working with a population that require immense support. But as most people blame the teachers not much changes. There is a reason that the "Effective Teachers" are at the schools west of the park and it is not because the teachers, administrators, and community activists who work in education are not doing anything. If you are reading at a 3rd grade education in high school you need a lot of help. [/quote]

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