Toggle navigation
Toggle navigation
Home
DCUM Forums
Nanny Forums
Events
About DCUM
Advertising
Search
Recent Topics
Hottest Topics
FAQs and Guidelines
Privacy Policy
Your current identity is: Anonymous
Login
Preview
Subject:
Forum Index
»
Political Discussion
Reply to "Panetta: Israel may attack Iran in April"
Subject:
Emoticons
More smilies
Text Color:
Default
Dark Red
Red
Orange
Brown
Yellow
Green
Olive
Cyan
Blue
Dark Blue
Violet
White
Black
Font:
Very Small
Small
Normal
Big
Giant
Close Marks
[quote=jsteele][quote=TheManWithAUsername] I read the pieces, which regard two particular incidents. Are you saying that the many quotes attributed to him are all inaccurate? Here's a bunch: http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2009/04/questions-about-ahmadinejad-apos-s-famous-quote/9872/ If that's what you're saying, I'm not equipped to judge the translations and not up for the major research project of checking the context of every one of those. But the first question would be whether you actually think they're all false or distorted. [/quote] None of the quotes provides a source so it is impossible to verify context. However, they all follow a similar formula, which I can paraphrase as this: "The Zionist state is the root cause of conflict in the region and its aggressions are creating hostility. Eventually, as a result of that hostility and other historical factors, the Zionist regime will cease to exist". These are not threats to eliminate Israel. Just statements concerning something he believes to be an historical inevitability. If a US leader says "Eventually the Castro regime in Cuba will cease to exist", is he threatening to wipe out the Castro regime? I don't think so. [quote=TheManWithAUsername]Regardless, as I said, I believe that they support terrorism, that they abhor Israel, and that they hate us somewhat less. That's what makes them distinct, though unfortunately not unique. I obviously don't have access to the intelligence regarding their support for terrorism, and we apparently disagree on our government's trustworthiness on that point. I'm shocked if you'll disagree that they have expressed extreme hostility to Israel, but sorry, I'm not going to go over every single anti-Israel quote to explore it's reliability.[/quote] Clearly, the Iranian leadership has expressed extreme hostility to Israel. Equally clearly, Israeli leaders have expressed extreme hostility to Iran. I am not sure why either of those realities requires the US to be hostile to Iran. [quote=TheManWithAUsername]I appreciate that you think the bar should be higher when murder is considered. In this disagreement and in our last, you have seemed to take the position that one should not support such action, even as an armchair statesman, unless one has perfect certainty. [b]One of my points in both of these disagreements has been that we casually support all kinds of policies that can have far worse impact.[/b][/quote] I certainly try very hard not to support such policies. But, nevertheless, two wrongs don't make a right. Justifying a bad policy because we have worse policies doesn't seem particularly wise. [quote=TheManWithAUsername]Again, you seem to be treating me like I'm Sean Hannity. I don't believe that we were created by God to benevolently rule the world with the sword and bible. But I think it's equally absurd to say that governments don't differ in morality or that we're relatively immoral, if either is your position.[/quote] Of course governments differ in their morality. I vehemently disagree with the current Iranian government. This website has a green stripe across the top signifying my support for the Iranian opposition. There was a brief trend of websites taking this symbolic step some time ago. DCUM may well be one of the last remaining websites continuing to do it. But, my hostility toward the current Iranian regime does not mean that I will condone the killing of their scientists which I believe is morally wrong, pragmatically ineffective, and practically simply a step toward escalation. In fact, if killing Iranian scientists solved the problem as you seem to suggest, why would Panetta be predicting that Israel would attack Iran in April? I want to end this post by responding to this quote from the beginning of your post: [quote=TheManWithAUsername]Nice way to hedge your bets - if you win the argument, you win, and if you lose, it's because I'm an unreasonable jerk who never really says anything.[/quote] I detest the attitude that discussions are contests like a football game or hockey match. Discussions should not have winners or losers. This is not a debating club. Discussions are for sharing points of view and information. You have stated that you support the killing of Iranian scientists and provided a list of justifications for that support that I believe to be overly reflective of US propaganda. My intention is not win some sort of contest, but only to suggest that you consider that the policy you support may not be as effective as you imagine and that the justifications you provide may need to be questioned more than you seem to be willing. [/quote]
Options
Disable HTML in this message
Disable BB Code in this message
Disable smilies in this message
Review message
Search
Recent Topics
Hottest Topics