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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]

Taking god out of the equation makes everything so much more simple to understand.  Some good and bad things happen by chance; some happen based on human intervention.  There's no invisible entity to blame or thank and there's no eternal reward for believing in it.  That's the hardest part for people to accept and the main reason that belief in god persists.[/quote] I agree, you have to contort your thoughts so much to make any god theory fit with the world we live in.  I think the idea persists though because people just can't accept that their lives with all its problems, is all their is.  We want some sort of reward for being good. [/quote]

Belief in God is a matter of faith.  I don't believe anyone will ever prove or disprove the existence of God.  I happen to believe in a loving Creator, but I can understand that some people just don't buy it.  It does sound a little crazy, right? But I look at this world and all the craziness that we just accept as the way things are, the lies we accept as truths, and I think- it isn't any crazier to believe in God.  It isn't crazier to believe that the purpose of life is to love and serve others because God loves us and calls us to service.  [/quote]

The more that we discover about the extreme complexity of life the more I believe in intelligent design. The odds are far less for that than chance.

One of the co-discoverers of DNA wrote..."An honest man, armed with all the knowledge available to us now, could only state that in some sense, the origin of life appears at the moment to almost be a miracle, so many are the conditions which would have had to have been satisfied to get it going.

That man believes life on earth was created by an intelligent being from another world. Hmmm? An intelligent being not of Earth. Guess that can't possibly be God huh?

And those conditions, and the odds of survival as evolution occurred in the extremely infinitesimal advances that would occur along that route, makes me believe that there is less of a leap of faith to intelligent design, God, than it is to believe it all started with single cell organisms and somehow against odds beyond our ability to calculate made it from that to what we have today. Not only is the foundation of life complex, the incredible diversity of life is too.

Now, that doesn't mean I don't believe that life doesn't evolve. Of course it does. But where did it start? That's the key question and if intelligent design was at the beginning then surely evolution could be a part of that design.[/quote]

Continuing with your premise, who designed the designer?  That is -- how did it get there?  what created it?  Also -- assuming a designer, how does it fit with the stories of the multiple religions that have formed over time?  Is the designer one of those gods?  for instance the god of Abraham who eventually had his own son, who came to redeem the world for those who believe in him?  Or is it Abraham before Jesus, or Abraham after Mohammed or some other god completely?

To me, it all sounds like the type of speculation that can never be solved - it's just what people want to believe, what seems right, or what they've been taught by various religions.

As for "the co-discoverer of DNA" whom you quote - why not name him?  It was Francis Crick, an evolutionist who did not hold the beliefs you imply above.

As per wikipedia:  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Crick

Crick referred to himself as a humanist, which he defined as the belief "that human problems can and must be faced in terms of human moral and intellectual resources without invoking supernatural authority." He publicly called for humanism to replace religion as a guiding force for humanity, writing:

"The human dilemma is hardly new. We find ourselves through no wish of our own on this slowly revolving planet in an obscure corner of a vast universe. Our questioning intelligence will not let us live in cow-like content with our lot. We have a deep need to know why we are here. What is the world made of? More important, what are we made of? In the past religion answered these questions, often in considerable detail. Now we know that almost all these answers are highly likely to be nonsense, having sprung from man's ignorance and his enormous capacity for self-deception... The simple fables of the religions of the world have come to seem like tales told to children. Even understood symbolically they are often perverse, if not rather unpleasant... Humanists, then, live in a mysterious, exciting and intellectually expanding world, which, once glimpsed, makes the old worlds of the religions seem fake-cosy and stale... ":[78]
Crick was especially critical of Christianity:

"I do not respect Christian beliefs. I think they are ridiculous. If we could get rid of them we could more easily get down to the serious problem of trying to find out what the world is all about.":[79]
Crick once joked, "Christianity may be OK between consenting adults in private but should not be taught to young children."[80]

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So, were you ignorant of this information, had you been misled by someone or were you actively trying to mislead others?  Whatever the case, now that you have the correct information, please don't misrepresent Crick again. [/quote]

No...the reason I included [b]Crick's belief that life was created by an intelligent lifeform not of this world was so that there would be no misunderstanding that what he said was about God.[/b]

And this wasn't about Crick's beliefs so much as his amazement at the complexity of what they found. This complexity was so vast this man turned against the theory of evolution from a chance beginning with a single cell that so many scientist claim as the source of life, who calls Christian beliefs fables, turns around and proposes directed panspermia as the source. A theory that has absolutely no way of being proven.

One other thing...if I were writing a book I would have expounded more on Crick. But by including his quote I gave the opportunity, intentionally, for anyone reading what I wrote to do searches. Wonderful thing the internet.

As for who designed the designer? I have no idea. It is a mystery that I cannot solve. But it is one that regardless of a belief in God exists for all things. How did matter come to be? And how is the vastness of space and all that is contained in it sourced from a single 'ball' of it?[/quote]

Except Crick did't say that -- you did.  So if you're not being purposefully deceptive, it would seem that you have masterfully deceived yourself.  By including his quote, without naming him and without including other quotes about his specific feelings about religion, the only "opportunity" you provided was for misinformation.

Thanks for your response -- [b]it's a mirror into your mind and may also demonstrate how some religious people consciously or unconsciously delude themselves and others.[/b][/quote]

Again with the personal attacks...ridiculous.

The following details Cricks theory of intelligent lifeforms sending out 'seeds' etc. which translates into...life on this earth was created by intelligent beings from some distant...not of this world.

http://www.panspermia-theory.com/directed-panspermia

[/quote]
Yeah, right -- Crick was into Extraterrestrials -- and we're finding out about it for the first tie on DCUM.  Talk about the wonders of the internet -- and the desperation of someone who can't stand to be exposed for trying to trick people -- and perhaps themselves.

Perhaps it's best to focus on prayer and faith and give up beating this dead horse.[/quote]

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