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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]Public education has been ruined for years.  Let it crash and burn and we’ll start over. [/quote]

After our personal experience watching the once-great FCPS circle the drain and crumble around our teens, I agree that public education in the U.S. has indeed been ruined.

All the while: the U.S. Department of Education was fully funded.  The departments existence only made the problems worse.

I am a democrat who supports education but I am glad to see the department dissolved. [/quote]

Wrong. FCPS is the problem. I've worked in other states and FCPS is the issue not the department of education.[/quote]

You’re not wrong but not right either. As others have mentioned, school districts operate independently from dept of education and their issues such as with FCPS are due to poor leadership.

The dept of education is simply unnecessary and wastes millions of dollars adding no value in educating children. [/quote]

You seem to have zero knowledge of history. Prior to the civil rights era, the federal government had little involvement in education. However, due to segregation, it was necessary to intervene to end long standing discrimination. Every child deserves a chance at a quality education. The role of the US Dept of Ed is aimed at trying to ensure that. They are not perfect by no means. And, yes, there have been flawed policies.

Also, in a globally connected world, it is stupid to think that the education of a populace is not directly tied into the overall innovation and competitiveness of the country. Thus, it IS an issue for us as a nation if entire states are not educating their children. [/quote]

Education outcomes for students of all races have only declined since the dept of education was established.

You really should educate yourself before spouting nonsense.

This is a bipartisan issue. Anyone who works in education knows that the Dept of Education does more harm than good.

The only people who want to keep it are ideological know-nothings who have never stepped foot in classroom, [/quote]

If the Department of Ed is failing then why not fix it?  Plus, I don't believe it's true to say Department of Ed has failed in every area in the first place.  For example, Department of Ed has had demonstrable success rates in reducing dropout rates, improving college access through Pell grants, improved transparency via the College Scorecard, reduced predatory student loan programs, has improved special ed outcomes via IDEA, expanded pre-K programs. improved school safety and emergency preparedness, improved data collection and statistics about education in the US, supported free lunch programs, and so on.

Meanwhile I'd wager 90% of MAGAs aren't even aware of any of that and wants Department of Ed gone because of their delusional beliefs like "litter boxes for students who identify as cat gender" and "they want weird Common Core math" and crap like that which doesn't actually have anything to do with Department of Ed.[/quote]

“
For example, Department of Ed has had demonstrable success rates in reducing dropout rates, improving college access through Pell grants, improved transparency via the College Scorecard, reduced predatory student loan programs, has improved special ed outcomes via IDEA, expanded pre-K programs. improved school safety and emergency preparedness, improved data collection and statistics about education in the US, supported free lunch programs, and so on
“

Did you get this list from chatGPT. Most of it is meaningless and a perfect example of wasted taxpayer funds.

Improved data collection? 
Improved transparency?

Who cares when many school districts have cohorts of 9th graders that can’t read.

What special ed outcomes have improved specifically? Special ed in particular is the most breathtaking fraud waste and abuse of funds that I have seen.

You’re clearly an uninformed ideologue who has no experience in the public education system.

Education outcomes are abysmal and only getting worse.

Student proficiency levels have stagnated or declined since the early 1990s, with fourth- and eighth-grade reading proficiency at an average of 30%–31%. Math proficiency for both grades peaked in 2013 (42% for fourth grade and 35% for eighth grade) but has declined to 39% (fourth grade) and 28% (eighth grade).
[/quote]

Your dismissal of concrete metrics as "meaningless" and "chatGPT talking points" is intellectually dishonest and ignores how large-scale systems actually function. Let me address your points directly:

On "meaningless" metrics:
You can't simultaneously complain that "cohorts of 9th graders can't read" while dismissing data collection and transparency as meaningless. How exactly do you think we know about reading deficiencies? Through the very data collection systems the Department of Ed maintains via NAEP (National Assessment of Educational Progress). Without federal data standards, we'd have 50 different state measurements with no way to identify systemic problems or compare outcomes.

On Special Education:
You call IDEA "breathtaking fraud" but provide zero evidence. Before IDEA (passed in 1975), millions of children with disabilities were simply excluded from public schools or warehoused without education. Today, students with disabilities have enforceable rights to free appropriate public education in the least restrictive environment. Graduation rates for students with disabilities have increased from 55% in 2008 to 73% in recent years. That's not fraud, it's progress enforced by federal standards that many states would never implement voluntarily.

On your declining proficiency argument:
Yes, scores have declined, particularly post-COVID. But attributing this to the Department of Ed's existence rather than to underfunding, pandemic disruption, poverty, state-level policy failures, or district mismanagement is absurd causation. The Department of Ed doesn't run classrooms or hire teachers. FCPS's failures are FCPS's failures, not proof that federal oversight is harmful.

Your glaring omission:
You completely ignored Pell Grants, which have enabled millions of low-income students to access higher education. You ignored Title I funding that provides $18 billion annually to high-poverty schools. You ignored federal enforcement that prevents states from discriminating against students with disabilities, English language learners, and minority students; that's enforcement that wouldn't happen without federal oversight.

The "let it burn" fantasy:
Your "solution" of dissolving the department and "starting over" is not a plan. What happens to Civil Rights enforcement under Title VI and Title IX? Who ensures FAPE for students with disabilities? Who distributes $80+ billion in federal education funding? State departments that have repeatedly proven they'll shortchange vulnerable populations when left to their own devices?

Here's the bottom line:
Yes, the Department of Ed has serious flaws and needs reform, but claiming it provides "no value" while offering zero alternative mechanism for civil rights enforcement, data collection, or equitable funding distribution is not a serious policy position, it's destructive, counterproductive nihilism dressed up as tough talk. If you actually work in education, you should understand the difference between systemic challenges and scorched-earth rhetoric.  You are clearly unserious about actual policy and are making disingenuous arguments.[/quote]

There is no need to devote a cabinet level agency to metric collection. Yes, data is important but celebrating the act of gathering data as some of the “win” is ridiculous. It is the bare minimum. Although perhaps some credit is due for not falsifying data. Can you imagine if a business reported declining profits but then demanded accolades for reporting on it? Insane.

Special Ed is literally bankrupting school systems. All for students who are unlikely to be net contributors to our economy. Yes, they deserve an education. No, they do not deserve an egregiously high proportion of education dollars. You tout “graduation rates”. what good is a high school diploma when an individual is functionally illiterate.

Your point that declining literacy is more the fault of teachers omits the facts that the Dept of Education is responsible for pushing idiotic and counterproductive “innovative” approaches to literacy.

I noticed that you’re quick to talk about college Pell grants but strangely reticent to mention student loans. Crippling student loans debt (made worse when couple with low-income majors) is a generational issue. It has ruined the financial lives of many who lacked the financial education to understand that taking about $400K for a social work major is a bad idea.

Here’s the bottom line: it’s clear that you have never stepped foot in a classroom and are completely ignorant about how the Dept of Education fails students, especially low income. Your privilege and ignorance is not just ill-informed, it’s actively harmful to public school students.

How dare you accuse me of “nihilism” when my life has been committed to public education. Public education is administered at the state and local levels. Federal level policy does nothing but make that job harder and enrich DC bureaucrats.

[/quote]

You're clearly a liar and a fraud because you got so many fundamental things wrong that someone in public education would know better.  Go take a flying leap with your "how dare you" crap.[/quote]

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