Reply to Is Real Change Even Possible?

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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]Tell me what are the job outcomes for your AP students? Maybe kids should be focused more on learning life skills as they go to HS. Going to college is no longer the meal ticket to a good job.

Not saying no rigorous education but it’s not the end all be all anymore. Going to a great college also doesn’t translate to a great job.[/quote]

The job market is tough, but not going to college isn’t the solution. What job would you expect someone to get without a degree?[/quote]

DP but there are tons of jobs for kids with trade skills in welding, electrician, machining et al.

WSJ just ran an article about some HSs opening large VoTech shops and getting funding from private industry because there are so many unfilled trade jobs (which blows a hole in the argument that there aren’t good factory jobs).

Every kid in the welding class gets an internship and is offered a FT job with most starting around $80k.

Now, you can’t just go get a job at a car company with zero skills like you could in the 1950s, but you can acquire these skills for little to no cost.[/quote]

The WSJ can talk until they’re blue in the face but the 2 million dollar lifetime earnings premium to college graduation is a stubborn reality.

Also, invariably, people who point to the trades have never actually worked in a trade. Your body is mostly broken by the time you hit 40 in many if not most trades. [/quote]

This. People were okay taking manual labor jobs at a time when life expectancy was shorter and when it was feasible to get a pension after say 20 years of service. You might never be rich but around the time you physically couldn't do the job anymore, you could retire and live okay.

Cost of living is much higher and people live much longer. Social security kicks in later and the vast majority of jobs in the trades don't have pensions. [b]What happens when someone without a college degree is simply physically no longer able to climb up on roofs or get under cars on a daily basis, and they have no pension and social security is at least 15 years away? What do they do in the meantime.[/b] Another thing that used to happen is that businesses would take care of their own a bit and someone in this position might be kept on in a management position to help train younger workers and oversee jobs. But now these businesses have been corporatized or bought up by private equity, and someone like that is seen as dead weight that is not sufficiently profitable. Out you go.

If my kid wanted to go into a trade, I'd still suggest they get at least an associates degree in business so that they have a way to segue from the labor side to management, start their own business, etc. If they wanted to go straight into a trade, I'd help them find night or other PT programs to ensure they got some kind of academic training in a practical field that would complement that work. My brother worked construction in his 20s while getting a degree -- it is tough for a while but in the end puts you in a better position than many other college grads because you have more money and you have real work experience.

I want my kids thinking of options for when they are 35, 45, 55. I don't care if they have white collar jobs but I don't want them to be short sighted and then have major regrets when they want to buy a house, when they blow out their knee, when their own kid has college aspirations. [/quote]

First, very few jobs these days have a pension...in fact almost none.  We have 401k accounts which nearly every company provides regardless of your job function

Second, there are many trade jobs working at large companies that come with benefits, 401k retirement options, etc.  Those companies also allow the junior welder to move up through the organization and become management of the welding/trade groups, so no you aren't having to perform the same physical tasks at 50 as when you were 20.

The WSJ article wasn't showing kids going to work for some mom & pop operation, but some large companies (and some small companies too).[/quote]

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