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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]This is a great question and has perplexed me forever. Why would anyone who is middle class or poor and in danger of losing a job or health care vote for the Trump. A rich guy who has gotten there on the backs of these very people, who will never think about them and only themselves. It is like they believe if they just get a guy in office that looks like them they will be just fine. Someone explain how people consistently vote against their own pay checks and families. Is it fear? Is it hatred? Who does this?[/quote]

It’s quite simple, really. 
Many of us in the middle class realize that the more “power” we give to the government in taking care of us, the more freedoms we lose as a result. 
Like the ACA - we essentially handed over the power to the government to mandate health insurance for all, and in turn, gave up our freedom to choose what plan suits us and our families.  Don’t need birth control?  Too bad, you’ve got it.  [b]And, you don’t have young kids who need dental coverage? [/b] So sorry, pal, you get it anyway.  
So, simply put, we value freedom more than we value “free things.” 
[/quote]
? [b] If you don't have young kids why are you getting coverage for young kids?    And if you do have young kids, you do need some kind of dental coverage. [/b]That's crazy to think you don't.

Hey, I hate that we have such easy access to guns, but sorry, pal, we get it anyways.[/quote]

See, this is my problem with those people who are so gung-ho about the ACA. 
Pediatric dental coverage is REQUIRED for all ACA-compliant plans - whether you have children or not. 
Guess you didn’t know that.  Makes me wonder what else you don’t know about it.

[quote]Dental insurance, for the most part, isn’t covered under ObamaCare (the Affordable Care Act). However, children’s dental coverage is a required benefit included on all ACA compliant plans and cost assistance can be applied to any Marketplace plan that includes dental.[/quote]

http://obamacarefacts.com/dental-insurance/dental-insurance/[/quote]

Yes, but if you don't have children on your plan you don't get pediatric dental. Get it now? [/quote]

I don't understand why this discussion of ACA is in this thread.  It should be a thread all its own.

I'd like to point out, though, that you are still paying for pediatric dental, even if you don't have children.  You just aren't getting the benefit.  The point people are saying is that because ACA plans have to include those things, they can't discount their plans for people who don't want that coverage.  So if you are a man and get an ACA-compliant plan, the plan still includes pregnancy coverage, birth control, et cetera.  You don't get a cheaper rate, even though you won't use those benefits because they are standard features of the plan.

That's the point you are missing.  The upside is that those features don't cost more if you do need them.  For example, pre-ACA, a woman purchasing a plan on the open market would have to pay more for the pregnancy coverage.  Now, she doesn't have to because it is standard.  But the unintended consequence is that everyone pays more.  It's not like the insurance companies just take a hit.  The cost is just spread around.

Where I differ with the people who are complaining about ACA is that I think singlepayer is a better option because it takes some of the power out of the hands of insurance companies, which are for-profit entities. [/quote]

No, if you don't coverage for minors, you are not paying that premium. You pay for yourself or yourself and spouse. Therefore you are not paying for pediatric dental.

Now, pregnancy coverage is another matter. Non-pregnant people do pay for this.

However, in both cases requiring that plans have this is a benefit to society. [/quote]

You simply don't get to choose what you want coverage for . . . you can't say, not traveling to Africa, no yellow fever coverage for me this year!  I'll take cancer coverage, but no diabetes, please.

[b]Insurance is not now nor has it ever been[/b] a cafeteria where you can pick and choose precisely what you will be covered for.  It is an actuarial risk management pool and if if something is found in the pool, its covered.

If it really bothers you that pregnancy is covered, lobby for gender based risk pools.  You will be surprised when you have opted out of pregnancy and find your rates going up because you have eliminated the healthier half of the pool.  Yes.  Women are healthier.  Do you hear them complaining about paying higher rates because they have to cover the risks associated with men's stupid tendency not to seek prophylactic  health care?[/quote]

You are wrong.  Employers pre-ACA were able to pick and choose what coverage and what exclusions their plans would offer.  Private insurance also offered options.  In my 20s, I had a 6-month gap between employer-provided plans.  I purchased a barebones health insurance plan in the private market.  I didn't need pregnancy coverage, so I picked a cheaper plan that didn't offer pregnancy coverage.

Those options don't exist now because of ACA.

I'm not saying that is definitely a bad thing.  I'm actually for singlepayer.  I never said that it bothered me that pregnancy is covered.  I'm just stating the facts that in the private market, that was often an extra rider you needed to purchase.  You can argue that's better or worse, but you can't argue the fact that that is how it was.

People were upset because they knew with ACA the barebones health insurance (cheaper) options would be phased out because now all plans have to offer certain types of coverage.  Some people liked having the option of purchasing cheaper barebones coverage.

I think that where ACA fails is it tries to be too many things.  It mandates coverage on the part of insurance coverage and mandates that people purchase coverage but it also tries to pretend that it still gives choice and it's still a "market."  The result is that it fixes some problems but does so at the expense of taking away choices from people while at the same time giving the insurance companies more power and still retain the ability to recoup their profits in other ways (i.e., increasing all rates to make up for the coverage like pediatric dental and pregancy coverage that all plans are supposed to include).[/quote]

That's one of the biggest failures of pre-ACA healthcare - that people would either not have any coverage at all, or would pick a bare bones plan that ended up not covering anything at all when they got sick or injured.  Pre-ACA, lack of healthcare coverage has been one of the biggest sources of personal bankruptcy in America.  There is already plenty of economic evidence to prove that the kind of overconfidence/arrogance/ignorance of not getting insurance or getting a bare bones plan will quite likely come back to bite you in the ass.[/quote]

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