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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][code][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]To say they *only* care about immigration, lgbt, etc is *profoundly* clueless.  They do in fact care quite a bit about, jobs, the economy, national security, etc.  [/quote]

When was the last time there was a liberal march for jobs, the economy, and national security - not as a side issue, but the main issue of the march. [/quote]

When did conservatives last march for those things?  Not anytime in the last 30 years...

They didn't march, and neither did libs, so what's your point?  Libs should be held to a different standard?  We don't march about those because by and large we are in pretty good shape in those areas.  We haven't had major terrorism issues and the hype around illegals far exceeds reality.[/quote]

Well, republicans in general don't march or protest, we are much more about individual responsibility and action than collective complaining. Take a look at the list of protests and marches in DC:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_rallies_and_protest_marches_in_Washington,_D.C.#2017

As you can see, liberals tend to protest and march about the issues that care deeply about. Therefore, it would be indicative that liberals care deeply about jobs, the economy, and national security if they also marched about those things with the same frequency with which they protest and march about immigration, LGBT, and etc... [/quote]

Individual responsibility and action is a big part of what makes up collective responsibility and action, you act as though the two are somehow incompatible or contradictory.  They aren't.   That said, collective action and responsibility are tremendously more effective and successful than individual action and responsibility because of the force multiplier of having more people aligned for a common goal.[/quote]

This is because you are confused about the difference between individual liberty/responsibility and collective action. Go study the difference between liberalism and conservatism, their platforms with regards to the individual and the collective. The words don't mean what you think they mean because they have additional meaning beyond their literal interpretation. In the same way that liberalism in the US means very different things with liberalism in Europe. Individual liberty/responsibility doesn't mean people stop working together, to the contrary, this is the best type of working together because each person is doing their best to perform their part. In the liberal view, individual liberty/responsibility, even as participants in a larger group, has a much smaller role in the outcome; the individual is therefore dependent on the collective and a powerful central government to advocate on their behalf. Examples of how the two ways of thinking is how to approach the problem of poverty: conservatives may support training and job programs, where each person can improve the value of their labor, and therefore is better able to lift themselves out of poverty; democrats on the other hand will feel that individual effort will have limited effect, and call for programs such as welfare, affirmative action, and push these programs through the government.

Another example is worker's unions. Unions are a liberal idea and their members are almost always democrats. People who don't belong to unions feel that individuals have the liberty/responsibility to find the type of employment they want and at a fair compensation. People who do belong to unions rely on the collective to protect their jobs and pay. Both non-union and union people work with others very well to get what they want. [/quote]

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