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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]
But respectfully, that's kind of my point. I'm not sure our language could ever adequately define "God".  And I think that's a good thing.[b] Our relationship with Creation or with what a spiritual person migh call God or Spirit is so very personal[/b]. I would never want to define that relationship for another being. If an atheist finds cosmic order in Science and Mathematics, in my mind that IS Devine. That is his answer to the puzzle of the universe. People change their views on religion and spirituality.  The Christian you meet today could be an atheist tomorrow. And I know lots of atheists who find spirituality later.  As a Hospice minister, I see this almost every day.

It's a journey.  The only thing I know with certainty is that none of us have the answers.  We are all learning, growing, and changing. It's important that we learn to acknowledge that our faith is not the only one that is "right".  I can allow space for both of us to be right. [/quote]

Can you accept that even your use of language is something that some atheists don't relate to.  I don't think in terms of having a "relationship with creation"

You also say that you know "with certainty" that "none of us have the answers" while there are some devout Christians who would disagree with that.  They HAVE the answer -- Jesus is the answer.  And an atheist's answer might be that the world makes more sense without a benevolent God in it

And you speak in terms of "our faith" as if everyone has one -- and many people don't -- never did, or rejected it.   Sure they may have faith in something -- the laws of nature or some of their fellow human beings - but it's not faith as in religious faith and they wouldn't call it faith.

As for seeing atheists who find spirituality "almost every day"  - no way to prove this is right or wrong -- it's your perception stated as fact -- and I doubt I'd perceive whatever you're seeing the same way.   Maybe I'd call it "making peace with their fate" and maybe you, seeing it through the eyes of a Christian minister call it "finding spirituality."

We certainly think and speak differently about religion and at this point, I suspect atheists are much more familiar with how religious people think and speak than vice versa, because many atheists were once religious and we all live in a world permeated by religion.[/quote]

To answer your questions.  Because I believe they are important -

1. Yes.  I accept that many atheists will not relate to my language.  I don't even believe my language is the correct one.  It's simply me using my belief system and life experiences.  Nothing more. I not only accept this, I honor it.

2.  Many faiths teach that they have the answers.  That they are "right".  I disagree with this 100%.  I understand where they are coming from. I can respect their faith.  I was raised in an evangelical home and understand what they feel is at risk.  Eternity burning in hell is a powerful motivator.

3.  I think most people have faith in something.  I have faith that the sun will rise tomorrow.  I don't think faith is necessarily connected to a traditional concept of "God".

4.  I was speaking literally when I said atheists often find a faith path at the end of life.   They do.  You may not like it.  But I see it happen almost every day.  You could argue that the reality of death is scary and that fear causes people to reach out to God as a last resort.  [b]As a minister, I think we are naturally programmed to return to our Source. [/b] I believe dying people are experiencing something that we cannot really understand.  An atheist would explain that with Science.

5.  We do speak and think differently.  And I honor and respect that.  What we need is more civil conversation just like this.  When we are able to respect one another without name calling or shaming, we all benefit.

Wishing you peace.[/quote]

If you don't want name calling, please stop with the condescension & presumptions. 
[/quote]

NP. You are a seriously fragile snowflake if you think any of what the minister wrote amounts to condescension. Your outrage seems feigned. Meanwhile you ignore--or probably authored--some seriously abusive posts here calling religion "bs stories" and "nonsense," not to mention the whole premise of this thread. You win the Hypocrite of the Day prize, maybe Hypocrite of the Week.[/quote]

Different atheist poster here -- I can see both points of view.  Sometimes religious people are so accustomed to being in the mainstream that they don't realize when they appear to be condescending to non-religious people.  Also, I can see how the atheist responder could be fed up with this type of response and be a bit to short with someone who was inadvertantly insensitive.[/quote]

I am the PP minister and that's exactly why I apologized.  Rather than take the attack personally and assume the worst, I'm going to remember that tone is very difficult to read in an internet post. If the pp took my post as condescending, perhaps I could have worded it better. It's also important to remember that we really have no idea what is going on in someone's life.  Maybe the pp feels attacked and judged in her real life by overly religious people.  That would make anyone a little defensive.

It's all love. And we are all on our own paths. My prayer/wish is just that we learn to be kinder to each other.  [/quote]

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